E48 | Eric McMahon: An Advocate for the Industry

[00:00:00] Donnie: Welcome to the team behind the team podcast. I’m your host Donnie Maeve. This is the monthly show focused on building conversations around the team based model approach to athletic performance, strength and conditioning, sports medicine, sports science, mental health and wellness, and sports nutrition.

[00:00:26] Donnie: Hello and welcome back to the team behind the team podcast. I’m your host Donnie Maeve and we have got. An incredible episode for you, uh, this month. It is summer here in Austin, Texas. The temperatures have been scorching hot. Coach Joe, what are you doing to combat this heat right now? Well,

[00:00:47] Joe: I’m always complaining about it on this podcast, but I have a legitimate reason this time.

[00:00:51] Joe: Last week was the hottest week in Austin ever in history. It was, it was pretty intense. Uh, I just, I just don’t go outside coach. Let’s hide in the A. C.

[00:01:03] Donnie: Joe, this summer I had a new revelation of Texas. He, this is the first time ever in all my, I’ve lived here for 20, almost 25 years that my eyes actually felt like they were hot, but he has gotten to that level of my eyelids were like, I feel like they’re going to melt off.

[00:01:17] Donnie: So it’s a different kind of heat in Texas. People always say that, but it’s true. So,

[00:01:22] Joe: Oh, and I mean, like our, like our guests, I’m a, I’m a Northern guy from Michigan. So, yeah. It, it, it, it’s hard, man. It’s, I mean, it’s probably the same when the southern guys go up north and it gets cold up there. I’m like, yeah, that’s nothing.

[00:01:35] Joe: But it, it, it was legitimately hot this, this past week. So

[00:01:40] Donnie: push. We’re super excited again, hot in Texas. No better time to bring on our guests. Who’s gonna bring the heat today? I know he will. Coach Eric McMahon. Welcome to the show Coach.

[00:01:51] Eric: Hey guys, thanks for having me

[00:01:54] Donnie: coach. I’m so thankful that you made time.

[00:01:56] Donnie: I know you got your plate is Loaded with what you got going on at NSCA. So Excited to have you on the show and I know you got just so much diverse experience, not only in coaching, but also just developing leaders in this industry. So we’re excited to have you on.

[00:02:12] Eric: Yeah, I appreciate that. Uh, hearing you guys talking about the heat.

[00:02:16] Eric: I was actually the, uh, strength and conditioning coach for the Round Rock Express right up the road from you guys a few years ago. And, uh, Man, I know that heat, so I feel it, and uh, we just got back from Las Vegas where it was 115 on the pool deck, just outside the conference at Caesars Palace, so, uh, yeah, we, I mean, you’re hearing about all the record temperatures right now, but man, it’s, uh, 115, that’s no joke.

[00:02:44] Eric: Yes, sir.

[00:02:45] Donnie: Um, well, coach again, we’re gonna get right into the show. So glad you’re here. I want to just give some highlights to our listeners of who they’re listening to. And again, coach Eric McMahon. He is the N. S. C. A. Coaching and sports science program manager. That’s his role currently since 2020. If you look at your just star studded career up to this point, coach, you have a lot of Experience with Major League Baseball from the Texas Rangers, the Brewers, um, some European programs, uh, uh, U.

[00:03:18] Donnie: S., in the U. S. internationally on strength and conditioning topics. She presented on a ton of those. Uh, Coach, I love just going through such a diverse… background. You’ve done some, uh, you’ve done some data analytics through Cornell University. You’ve got that been through that certificate course. You’ve done some tactical strength, conditioning, certification stuff there.

[00:03:39] Donnie: Um, USA weightlifting, precision, precision nutrition, uh, with, you know, kettle bells. yoga, you name it, you’ve got it. And now you’ve got those different, uh, coach out. What’s the difference on these, uh, NSEA certifications. I’d like to just clarify that the RSCC with D and then the other one was what?

[00:04:02] Eric: Yeah. So we have.

[00:04:03] Eric: Five certification programs at the NSCA. Most people probably are familiar with the CSCS, certified strength and conditioning specialist. And when you see a star D after one of our credentials, that just means that, uh, there’s more education. Added to that. So you have a continue if you get more continuing education units on a certification and you get a with distinction added to your certification.

[00:04:28] Eric: So, yeah, you mentioned that I, I recently sat for the, uh, tactical strength and conditioning facilitator exam. Uh, just, uh. and learn about that area a little bit. And, uh, it’s, uh, that’s an area that’s obviously growing really quickly in the field and, uh, just wanted to be well versed in that. Uh, we have a sports science certification that just took off.

[00:04:54] Eric: Uh, we have about 300 certificates right now, and that program’s relatively new. Uh, we have a special populations. Certificate certification program and we have our CPT so that kind of makes the NSCA unique and that we have five certification programs. When you look at other organizations like physical therapy or athletic training, typically you’re just going to have one credential represented by an organization.

[00:05:21] Eric: But we know and I think we’ll talk about it today. Just how diverse this profession is. Uh, you know, there’s there’s a need for. A lot of areas of specialization and knowledge, and so we want to meet that need from the NSCA. Our SEC registered strength and conditioning coach is a designation for experienced coaches in the field.

[00:05:40] Eric: So you have, it’s, uh, I always explain it like this where coaches, you know, You know, we’ll, we’ll use like a med school or a medical example, you know, a physician graduates from medical school and they pass their, their board exam or they pass their licensing exams and they can go and practice as a physician.

[00:06:01] Eric: But within a few years, they become board certified. So it’s more a representation of their experience in the field. the job that they’re doing and their ongoing continuing education and professional development in the space. That’s really what the registered strength and conditioning coach designation is.

[00:06:19] Eric: And it, uh, helps us differentiate ourselves from some of the dual certified folks out there, which we love them. And we love when our athletic trainers and physical therapists have knowledge of strength and conditioning. But our role is unique in empowering to our environment. And we want to, from the NSCA, make sure that we are, uh, standing by our dedicated strength and conditioning coaches in the space.

[00:06:44] Donnie: That’s good stuff. That is definitely the trend. So you guys, man, appreciate you guys, uh, helping lead that way for us as an industry. Thank you, coach. And with that kind of the. The first thing I just want to jump into, uh, I’m excited. You just got back, you mentioned from Vegas and wrapped up that conference.

[00:07:03] Donnie: Uh, how was it coaching? Give us some highlights from it. What kind of stood out to you?

[00:07:08] Eric: Man, I like a typical Vegas trip. I stayed inside most of the time with that 115 degree heat. Uh, it’s hard to find the doors when you’re on that casino floor. But so we were at Caesar’s palace and in the past we’d been at Paris and some of the other hotels there.

[00:07:23] Eric: Caesar’s is huge. So just getting set up and signage and all the things you think about from a, uh, organization standpoint, you know, there was a big, uh, there was a big setup period and we had a lot of staff there. Uh, it was, I mean, I think the best part for me is, you know, we know the content’s going to be great.

[00:07:44] Eric: We have a lot of great speakers. We put a lot of time into that. Uh, the best part for me is always going to the special interest group meetings, the professional development group meetings. These are. Truly working sessions where we’re talking about what people are hearing. People are bringing concerns, thoughts to us.

[00:08:01] Eric: Uh, it’s just an opportunity to have conversations like this, where we’re just kind of working through challenging scenarios, we’re presenting things that we’re working on, getting feedback from our community, uh, that. That is much needed, you know, we are a member organization and when you’re in an association, it’s, we’re only as strong as our members and our people that show up at events and are, are volunteering and getting involved.

[00:08:27] Eric: So, uh, to me, it’s. I joke with people that I love the sessions and maybe it’s just where I’m at in my career, but I actually, when I walk out of that session door and in the hallway or on lunch break, I feel like that’s where I get most of my work done at these conferences. Uh, just those conversations stick with me and fuel me for the full year.

[00:08:52] Eric: So it’s something that, uh, yeah, that those are always the highlights for me.

[00:08:58] Donnie: Yeah, it’s always interesting. Right. I agree with you. I couldn’t more wholeheartedly agree that, you know, there’s, there’s amazing content. Y’all, your conferences, but the depth of fellowship connection, networking, uh, conversations, it’s a spur on creativity, problem solving pain points.

[00:09:19] Donnie: We’re all dealing with. You come out of there, right? Just kind of almost like invigorated, inspired, refreshed, yeah. You know, excited again. And so, man, it’s, it’s something that I, I put a tremendous amount of value. So that’s good stuff. Cause Joe, you got anything? Yeah. Oh, I, I

[00:09:35] Joe: just wanted to ask, um, you know, coach, you’ve been in your role then SCA as the sports science program manager since 2020, can you kind of dive into your career, uh, real quick and then tell us how your career prepared you for the role you’re

[00:09:49] Eric: invited.

[00:09:50] Eric: Yeah, that’s a, that’s a great question because I’ll just say personally, I’ve always really had interests in areas of field where there were gaps or just things that seemed cool and unique that, uh, maybe not everyone was doing. So when you, when you take that approach, you’re kind of chasing a rabbit and you don’t really know if it’s there.

[00:10:11] Eric: Uh, this role I have now, I, I never knew this would exist. It’s truly, uh, you and. Donnie, you, you mentioned it. I have a lot of different experiences, but, uh, it, it is a, truly a good fit for me and just the way my mind works. I feel like, but so I grew up in Burlington, Vermont, and I always. Kind of poke fun at myself and that, you know, in a small state like that, you can be pretty average at sports and have a really fulfilling athletic experience.

[00:10:43] Eric: So, you know, I got to play three varsity sports in high school. I got to do a lot of other sports in middle school and all the way up through. And, uh, I was never really that athlete that knew what I was great at. I just wanted to do everything and. Uh, you know, I remember a few football camps I went to and, you know, I was really motivated when a, it was a D3 college football coach got up there and said, you know, if you want to play football or a sport in college, you know, there is a place for you to play if you’re willing to travel or go and pursue that opportunity and here’s the way to do it.

[00:11:17] Eric: And so I took that as motivation. And I ended up playing Division 3 college football at St. Lawrence University. I always said, you know, I played football, hockey, baseball in high school. Uh, you know, football was probably the sport I was best at, but hockey I had the most fun and baseball was the sport I knew the most about.

[00:11:37] Eric: And, and so I didn’t really abandon those, but I went the direction I thought I Should go or needed to go. And, uh, that’s where I had my first strength and conditioning experience. So that’s where I discovered the field. And I just being the athlete, I was strength and conditioning gave me a vehicle to get on the field, get on the field and be able to play and contribute to the team and, uh, just in committing to that process.

[00:12:06] Eric: I realized that there was a specific job out there, maybe not at the division three level at the time, that I could do this and give back that rewarding experience to other, other student athletes. And so that was really my motivation to get into it. And then it kind of gets into the, you know, I think my first search at jobs in the field was, uh, I just narrowed down a list of schools.

[00:12:32] Eric: You know, division one schools that had like football, hockey, and baseball, like my sports thinking like many coaches I’m going into college athletics, or that’s where most of the jobs are, but it’s funny how things kind of come full circle. I, I. My first job as a, uh, as a kid, I was a parking attendant at a professional baseball stadium, and I kind of worked my way into ground screw.

[00:12:56] Eric: And when you’re on the ground screw, you’re a little closer to the players and you get to know some of the relievers and what they’re going through. But I also was a floor trainer because I didn’t want to pay for a membership at the locals. So I worked as a floor trainer, you know, I wasn’t certified in anything yet, but I was just kind of monitoring the facility.

[00:13:13] Eric: Uh, and that was the facility that visiting teams came in to train at. So I actually, you know, I’d be at the field. I’d see him hit batting practice. They didn’t really have dedicated strength coaches there. Sometimes I’d see like a coordinator come in and they’d set up ladder drills or something. But then I’d go to my other job and, uh.

[00:13:33] Eric: You know, the Red Sox would be coming into town. It was their little spinners, the A ball team. And I’d see, uh, I mean, one standout conversation I had, it was with their team athletic trainer. They didn’t have a strength and conditioning coach. And my perception at the time was this session’s not really being run that well.

[00:13:52] Eric: You know, it was kind of a free for all in there. And, uh, so that I just realized through a lot of different areas that there was this need in baseball for more professionalism around strength and conditioning that, um, you know, I was a bio major undergrad and that fueled me, that made me think that, you know, bringing me to baseball.

[00:14:14] Eric: You know, when you talk about upper body or, um, overhead sports and just the knowledge of the upper body and rotational sports, I felt like I was a good fit to go into that space. So went to Springfield College, got my master’s in, uh, exercise science. Obviously that’s a great program to get into the strength and conditioning field and build a network there.

[00:14:35] Eric: And, you know, I, I actually got hired with the Brewers after my first year in grad school. So, uh, Things just started going really well for me as a young professional, like they do for a lot of young coaches, and, uh, it was, it’s been really rewarding just to follow that. I’ve always, uh, been really thankful that I’ve been with teams and organizations that valued strength and conditioning, uh, because that hasn’t always been the case.

[00:15:04] Eric: And it’s something that, uh, you know, I was able to stay with Texas for 11 years and that, you know, I know coaches that had a lot of stops in that amount of time. So it was, I think when you have a little bit of longevity in a place, you’re able to think about your approach. Over and again and, and reinvent some things and try some different things and you’re not always under the gun for, uh, feeling like you’re going to be out the door the next year.

[00:15:32] Eric: So that really helped me develop and gain a lot of perspective on the profession and build a network. And I think that’s really what really fueled me to think I could do something in a role for the NSCA. Uh, it’s. Getting, getting to know everybody and their scenarios and, uh, you know, our field can get pretty fiery at times, but I like to think that I at least have the experience to relate some of.

[00:16:01] Eric: Some of to some of those experiences or hardships or challenges that people have in the field, because I think that’s what it all boils down to when we’re when we’re getting a little getting a little rowdy over some of the debates in the field, and we’re, you know, I think we at my at my core. I believe we do have.

[00:16:18] Eric: A lot of the same values and goals in this profession and, and we are a community, uh, and so, uh, that’s, that’s really what it’s about for me. I get to help a lot of people in this role. You know, my kids joke with me that, you know, hey, hey, dad, remember when you used to be a coach? And I, uh, and I’m like, well, I’m still a coach.

[00:16:38] Eric: I just coached the coaches now and I’m working with people, uh, in the same profession, but it’s, it’s, um, it’s funny to hear how, how they see it too. So,

[00:16:49] Joe: um, I saw you had a certificate course in data analytics from Cornell as well. Did, was there a point along the way that you, um, had to start wearing like two hats per se, or like, uh, you kind of had to take on like a sports science role as well as like your strength coaching role?

[00:17:05] Eric: Yeah. So, so we are seeing that in the field right now. Uh, there’s a lot of growth and it was something that, um, I’d actually, you know, I follow a lot of coaches, you know, coming from Vermont, you have to, you have to know who’s out there in the profession you want to be into. So I, I, um, I actually saw, you know, MBA, former MBA strength coach, Bill Burgos, uh, had completed that data analytics program.

[00:17:30] Eric: And I know education, I know him pretty well now, and education’s huge value to him, uh, and his past. So. just connecting with him along the way and asking, Hey, was this valuable to you? Uh, my, my perspective on that is that, you know, in grad school, we all get, and most of us, a lot of us have grad degrees in this profession.

[00:17:57] Eric: We, we get exposed to statistics and data analytics in these areas, but we’ve never really been. Encouraged to utilize those skills, maybe until recently in this profession, so I consider that a refresher for me that I wanted to, uh, I wanted to be able to use those skills well, and I, I like working through things and deep data dives on computers, but I wanted to see how it.

[00:18:25] Eric: You know, see what else I could do in that area. And I was also doing a lot of velocity based training work, you know, as the assistant major league strength coach, you know, I was, for the first time, there was more than one stranding conditioning coach on the team, you know, on my team. So I had a little bit more time to look at data and what it actually meant in the testing we were doing.

[00:18:46] Eric: So we were, I mean, in credit to. A lot of folks who were still there and the program we had and just how open minded we were. Um, you know, I was able to take that Assistant Strength and Conditioning Coach role and do some things with it that challenged me. And, uh, so that course was really a part of that.

[00:19:05] Eric: And there’s a lot of those programs out there now where you can find something that you’re, you know, maybe a little weaker in that you want to up skill in and, and I encourage coaches to do that. Yeah,

[00:19:17] Donnie: that’s awesome. Good stuff. Well, coach that that gives us a good segue. I got a, my next kind of topic for you is, you know, you are right there on the direct front lines of education.

[00:19:29] Donnie: You’re equipping coaches, sharpening coaches, uh, providing great content for, um, for this industry and your route. I mean, you’re rubbing shoulders every, every time with the brightest minds in our industry. So if you could take your magic crystal ball, Right. If you had that and you could look into the future, what are some innovations, changes, trends that you kind of see coming down the pipe, if you could kind of project that or predict.

[00:19:57] Eric: Yeah, this is a question I ask on my podcast and I think it’s really challenging for a lot of. Coaches to think that way in this profession, because we’re sometimes so we’re so in the moment of I need to do really good right now to protect my job. And that’s one thing I love about this role is that I get to be very forward thinking or try to be anyway.

[00:20:21] Eric: Uh, so obviously we have more technology in the weight room than ever before. Uh, there’s but I also see that. As we probably see that in our sport coach community as well, we have more engaged sport coaches than ever before in the area of monitoring athletes of workload. A lot of that’s to our credit.

[00:20:47] Eric: We’ve educated our athletic departments on the value of this and created more value for our positions and they’ve come a long way. Because of that, so you were starting to see more positions. You’re, you’re seeing more assistant roles. You’re seeing more analysts and sports science roles. You’re embedded with your academic departments, your math departments, your engineering departments.

[00:21:11] Eric: It depends on the size of your school, the resources you have. So, you know, when I go back, I’ll, I’ll be bold to say that. The science probably hasn’t changed much in the last 20 years. We were talking about power and force velocity in the 90s, in the early 2000s, but now we have really great technology to measure it and not just measure it in a lab.

[00:21:37] Eric: But measure it with our teams, uh, on the road when we’re traveling, uh, to do it before every training session. So it’s a lot more interactive. We get more data, more information. And so we need more people to organize that. And we’re seeing that on staffs. I do think, you know, there’s a, we talk about communication and collaboration a lot in the field right now.

[00:21:59] Eric: I still think there’s some underlying process areas of. That we need to unpack and we’re, I, the one thing I, it’s funny, I know Donnie, you and I talk a lot about books we read and I remember a lot of leadership, leadership books from years ago when I was just a student, like Coach K and Pat Summit and all these different books and maybe that dates me to the, when I was in school, but it was, I see a need for that now again, because when you have more people managing information, the value of quality leadership and to be able to funnel different opinions and thoughts and perspectives, uh, it’s so valuable to be able to lead the company.

[00:22:52] Eric: You still have to steer the ship, right? And so I think it’s something that, uh, that’s a need that’s emerging again. And I, I think that’s really valuable for, uh, for people to hear. I do see a little interplay between, you know, there’s always been that, like, are we assistant sport coaches that just do strength and conditioning?

[00:23:12] Eric: Or are we these dedicated, maybe medical model, strength and conditioning coaches? And it’s going to depend a lot on different your institution and how those models exist, but I think it’s a we’re at a healthy exchange right now in the field where I know coaches in some leagues and some levels that are paid really well more in a, um.

[00:23:41] Eric: sport, you know, very sports specific. They’re almost like skill coaches, like, uh, like a basketball coach or a football coach. Uh, but they also do the strength and conditioning or oversee that. But then you also see completely detached. Olympic departments servicing the entire athletic department. And it’s not to say one way is right or the other, but I, I find that really interesting right now.

[00:24:06] Eric: And, and we’re seeing more single sport strength and conditioning coaches at the college level. You know, we know that’s going to happen at the pro sport level. Uh, it’s not just football and basketball anymore. We’re seeing it in soccer. We’re seeing it in hockey. We’re seeing it in baseball. Uh, where’s that going to take us?

[00:24:25] Eric: So those are things I don’t have all the answers on, but I encourage us all to pay attention and think about those things when you’re looking at a job or the prospects of what your career might look like. Um, thinking about what that nine to five is, if you’re just the baseball guy or girl, or you’re or you’re one of the football staff or, or, or.

[00:24:46] Eric: Or if you’re in an Olympic department and maybe it’s a best fit type thing, where are you going to thrive the most in your career? So I think as a, and this is a good way to wrap this up. I do think as a field, we’re looking more at, I’ll call it work life balance, even though that may be not the best term for it because it’s, it’s really never balanced, but it’s, uh, it’s.

[00:25:08] Eric: Something that, you know, we are aware of those things now, and we’re trying to be better about that. So how does that reflect, you know, the decisions we make and the jobs we pursue? I, so career development, I think, is an area that’s on the forefront. You could say it’s always been, but I think we’re really, uh, on the cusp of tackling that.

[00:25:32] Eric: Is there any, like.

[00:25:34] Joe: Maybe skepticism involved with that, like with technology, I know AI is becoming a thing and chat GPT and all that. I, we had a former intern. He sent me like a full program, chat GPT generated. And all he did was ask it a question. Like it was, it’s pretty insane. Um, obviously there’s the human element that you can’t, can’t replace, but is, is there, uh, I guess like a, a sense of warning

[00:26:00] Eric: or something with that.

[00:26:02] Eric: I think it, I think there’s a little bit of a healthy fear in the industry right now about what that could mean, you know, and I think that that comes from, we know there’s people out there, including our athletes that are going to make that Instagram training decision that are going to make that easy to access.

[00:26:23] Eric: I can just Google a program and there’s a million of them out there. What’s the true value of. Paying for strength and conditioning services or buying into what they’re telling me when, you know, I’m a five star athlete, all world and everything I’ve ever been, you know, I, I think, I think this goes to what’s the value, what’s our value beyond just programming?

[00:26:48] Eric: You know, for our athletes and, uh, we’re, we’re at a time now where we’re starting to see some coaches, uh, that have been at institutions for a while that are creating great professional reputations for, for what we do and what we provide, and some of that’s just being there to support them, support the, support the troops, if you will support the athletic department, you know, I think.

[00:27:16] Eric: I think it’s kind of two pronged. Sometimes strength and conditioning coaches and all the performance staff and whatever your role, sometimes we’re there to build a foundation for all the athletic performance areas, and that’s what we think of, right? We’re there to build the foundation of athleticism, of conditioning, so that athletes can get on the field and be at their best.

[00:27:42] Eric: That supports our institution. But there’s other times, and these are the areas that when you get into the profession, you realize we’re, we’re the ones, we’re either the glue or the ones gluing the, uh, the coffee cup back together when it shatters on the floor, you know? And, uh, It’s something that that’s a different mindset.

[00:28:03] Eric: That’s a different approach than the traditional quadrennial plan or whatever it is that you’re building up a, you’re just building them up and setting them free. This gives us day to day responsibilities with these athletes, monitoring these athletes, checking in. Making sure that they’re, their heads in the right place, making sure that it may not be a performance thing, but we’re really a great first line of defense for, uh, keeping an eye on our athletes when the coaches are out recruiting and other things are going on, you know, we have so much access to these athletes and I think our strength as a profession is our ability to build relationships that, uh, the better we get at that, It, you know, our potential is really limitless in that way, uh, and, and our institutions crave that.

[00:28:53] Eric: And, and I think it’s our role to continue to encourage them to, to embrace those areas of our, of what we do.

[00:29:03] Donnie: Yeah, that’s good. I remember reading something recently coach about, you know, it was just giving some generic general kind of, uh, data on, you know, college. And what college does for you. And it was just talking about this was a Tim Elmore’s book on leadership.

[00:29:22] Donnie: The eight paradoxes of leadership, I think what it’s called. But he was saying in that book was pretty simple, but profound. You need roughly 75% IQ and 25% EQ to get your degree in college. But once you get it, when you get your job, right, especially as coaches, that ratio flips, you need about 75, I would say even higher, probably.

[00:29:44] Donnie: To 80% EQ, right? Emotional intelligence. And then the IQ, you definitely need that, but you got to have that, like you said, that ability to, to relate to, to a diverse group of individuals. And I think knowing diversity and. Backgrounds of how they were raised, right? And, and color and race, but also in, in just thought to how you program, how you lay out a plan, like maybe an athletic trainer that thinks completely adverse to maybe how you think, but can you work with that person and make that culture healthy?

[00:30:19] Donnie: So I agree. I think it’s. It’s a big piece of it. So,

[00:30:26] Donnie: yeah.

[00:30:26] Joe: And coach, one thing I noticed about your leadership and, uh, you know, you have a standout ability to, I guess, disarm people in a good way. And I don’t mean like, you know, John wick or anything like that. Uh, I’m more like, you know, there’s, you mentioned it earlier, actually, there’s a lot of big personalities.

[00:30:46] Joe: And this profession and people start discussing stuff and become very opinionated. Um, how do you, how do you do that? How do you go about being able to just carry on a cool headed conversation with, with such a, I guess, an alpha, you know, Alpha type community.

[00:31:05] Eric: Yeah. I, uh, well, I appreciate that. I, I, I think it’s something that, uh, it means a lot to me to be able to do that.

[00:31:12] Eric: But it goes back to when I said, just being able to relate to some of these experiences people have, but it’s not. Not in a way that pours fuel on the fire. I think, you know, there’s, to me, it comes down to fears that we have as, as men, as professionals, as coaches, whatever it may be, and decisions we make.

[00:31:37] Eric: So let me unpack that a little bit. You know, we all have fears. Uh, we’ll get into it in a little bit talking about family, but one of the biggest fears I had was how am I going to pursue this field that’ll take me far away from where I grew up, anywhere. You know, anywhere, but where I know people and how am I going to find someone that wants to chase me around and get married and have kids?

[00:32:01] Eric: I knew that was something important to me. So I had fears entering this profession. Um, that shapes you. I think recognizing that. You can, I think when people, even if they’re fiery, you can usually hear what is concerning them the most and what at their core really eats away at them or the challenging, uh, the challenges that they’re working through, because I think we’re all working through these things.

[00:32:27] Eric: I still have fears, you know, we all do, right? The other one is decisions, you know, at some point you made a decision to go to this grad school or go to this program or go to get this certification or whatever it may be. And, but the field’s moving and you don’t know when you go and when you go and pursue something, if it’s going to land or if it’s going to benefit you.

[00:32:52] Eric: Uh, 15, 20 years later, you’re. Going and doing an analytics certificate course or, or upskilling again in an area just that, that you’re a little deficient in. So I think it’s something that meeting coaches right in that spotlight. We, I get it, you know, we all made different decisions at different times and, but we’re all at a point now that I think there’s benefits either way.

[00:33:19] Eric: You know, there’s things you’re going to make one decision and it’s going to benefit you here. It’s going to hurt you there. And, you know, I may have made this decision and it benefited me here, but it hurt me there. So I approach it like that, you know, build on the areas where, you know, find what coaches are good at.

[00:33:35] Eric: Find what people, uh, you know, I think one of my funnest. Parts of this job is when I see something in someone that maybe they don’t see in themselves that is like, you know, Hey, coach, you know, the way you ran that warmup or the way you connected with your team or your head coach there, I might have just caught a glimpse of that.

[00:33:56] Eric: There’s something special about that. And here’s what I saw. Sometimes it’s completely eyeopening. That could be something that they write an article on or present on or help the field grow and empowering people to realize their strengths is truly, uh, is, is, I think my, my main approach there. I, I, you can’t, you can’t fix every problem for everybody, you know, and it’s something that it’s hard to turn your back on things.

[00:34:26] Eric: And I mean, I, I were very. Alpha where we push hard in this field. And I think sometimes you look, you know, something happens in a coach’s life or whatever it is, and you might address it real quick. And then you’re, you’re right back on, on your train track, just. Uh, you know, one thing I love about what I get to do is, uh, I get to live in that space where I get to see the whole person a lot of times and, and just, you know, my job at the NSCA is to be the coach in the building and show people we care and we truly do.

[00:35:05] Eric: Uh, and you all out there, all of our community, all of our members have. Information that can help guide us and I get to be a funnel for that. So I take it really seriously what I do in that space. And I, and I think that comes through when I talk to people, because I, you know, care goes a long way. And we, we talk about that a lot.

[00:35:26] Donnie: So coach, I want to hit on some stuff there. That’s got me kind of got me going a little bit. I love it. Uh, I just recently read a book by Adam Grant called think again, absolutely phenomenal read. Uh, cause you touched on this earlier in the show about how we just, you know, we can get so caught up in the weeds of our differences.

[00:35:52] Donnie: In this profession versus like, we’re really more alike than we are different. Like, I love how you said that earlier, but in this book, there’s a chapter called the vaccine whisperer. And it has nothing to do with the COVID deal or whatever. But anyway, there’s a story in there where Adam talks about this lady had a young girl.

[00:36:10] Donnie: That was either sick or potentially at a risk of getting this certain disease as a young baby, and she was just totally anti vaccine. And if she would get this vaccine, her kid was, I think, more prone to this disease, but she would be potentially just no risk of ever getting sick and dying. She wouldn’t budge.

[00:36:29] Donnie: And so they brought in this doctor, and I cannot recall his name from the book. You have to read the book now. It was profound. He, he came in and they, and like an hour later, she ended up getting the vaccine. That’s why he’s the vaccine whisperer. So they interviewed her after the deal and like, well, what you didn’t want to do, but what changed?

[00:36:47] Donnie: Here’s what she said, Eric. She said, I sat down and he started, he never preached at me or politicized, like politic to me or like, you know, judge me or condemn me for not wanting it. He just simply started asking questions about me. And my daughter, and she said, when he did that, he actually listened to me.

[00:37:09] Donnie: He changed my perspective. And I mean, today we need that more. We need more people like you, Eric, that are sitting down. Hey, let me know. Let me get to know you. Let me show you. I care. I’m actually in this battle with you and I’m not against you. And man, that approach, in my opinion, we need that. It’s fresh.

[00:37:27] Donnie: You do that. And it’s just profound and changes lives. So

[00:37:30] Eric: kudos to you. I appreciate that. It means a lot to me to be able to do that. I will, I will say that, you know, it’s something there’s times in all our careers where we have things we need to work on. And it’s something that, uh, this role has really brought that forward in me.

[00:37:50] Eric: And it’s personally very rewarding to be able to help people. And I think it brings me back to the why I got into this profession and that’s a, that’s a healthy exercise for everybody listening is, you know, you’re establishing your why early in your profession, but you always want to go back to that.

[00:38:07] Eric: You know, I go back to when I was fighting to get on the field as a college athlete and someone motivated me to push myself. And what does that look like in a career development lens? So, uh, yeah, I appreciate that. Coach,

[00:38:24] Donnie: let’s bridge right into this, this next one. I’m going to ask you one and Joe’s got one coming up, but, um, advocacy.

[00:38:34] Donnie: You know, I took a class years ago on this and it was life changing and I saw this in your, your resume and skill set. So a couple of things here, define advocacy and then unpack it a little bit in sport and why is it so important to be successful?

[00:38:52] Eric: Yeah, advocacy, when we ask our members and our coaches out there, uh, you know, it’s easy to say the NSCA is always.

[00:39:03] Eric: Done well with educational resources, but when we look at what our real needs are and what my real fears came from getting into this profession, it’s you kind of feel on an island, you know, at times this is not, you know, there’s a lot less strength coaches out there than there are other professions. And so we’re pursuing something that we have a strong passion for that maybe not everybody values the way we do.

[00:39:33] Eric: That takes advocacy. It takes, you can’t just be a member of the strength and conditioning profession today. You have to be an advocate and, and push it forward for the next generation. And, and in that, I have to accept that I’m not going to see all the growth in my lifetime. And when you can get to that place of the generations past really put me in a place to have The career I’m having, how can I leave it for the next generation?

[00:40:07] Eric: So to me, that’s a, that’s an approach or a mindset around advocacy that I think, uh, we all need to take in these roles. We all advocate advocacy in our profession means a lot of different things. We have to advocate for our roles. We have to advocate for our athletes. We have to advocate for our programs.

[00:40:28] Eric: We have to advocate for our budgets and all these different things. Uh, and we have to, we have to advocate to and from, you know, the NSCA and other organizations so that our field is actually taking shape the way. In a well informed way. You know, with a lot of different perspectives that helps take us to a positive place.

[00:40:52] Eric: So to me, advocacy in my role is representing the coaching community. And doing that in a way in the conversations I have access to that puts us in a better position than we have been in, uh, that might relate to athlete safety, uh, coaching qualifications. Those are areas I work on a lot, but it honestly might be on the more personal front of.

[00:41:23] Eric: You know what? The hustle culture model of being a strength and conditioning coach may not be sustainable for everybody over a 30, 40 year career. You know, we hear it all the time. How many of us are retiring as strength and conditioning coaches? Uh, I would love for that to be more common. You know, I, I’d love to give away more lifetime achievement awards at the NSCA because people can give.

[00:41:52] Eric: And contribute for that long, because it’s not just what you’re giving to the NSCA or, or from an organization standpoint, multiply every year you’re in the profession by every athlete and staff member in person, you represent strength and conditioning to in your daily life. And that is a massive compounding equation of the impact you have over your career.

[00:42:21] Eric: So it’s something that. You know, being advocates, we’re all advocates for this profession. I just have a unique role where I get to do it on a more regular full time basis. And, and with that, I get to help guide that process for people. So I encourage anyone, you know, anyone in the UT community or anyone in the field or profession to, uh, If this is a passion of yours, if advocacy in general is a passion of yours, you know, I, I, I do some mentorship with students at my alma mater and not all of them want to be strength and conditioning coaches, but advocacy is something that I, I feel like it’s a life.

[00:43:03] Eric: It’s a milestone that you will eventually get to. There’s going to be something in your life that you want or you want to improve in developing those skills. It might be in a completely different field, field. That’s going to be beneficial to other things that you’re doing. So I encourage people. I love working with students and people through hardships and challenges.

[00:43:28] Eric: And, and that’s kind of my approach to advocacy. Yeah, um,

[00:43:35] Joe: I had a question about, uh, it’s more like a risk management scale. So over the last, I guess in recent years, uh, we’ve seen things get tighter and tighter with, you know, safety, uh, restrictions on how we train athletes, things like that. Um, what have you seen over the last few years that has maybe improved?

[00:43:55] Joe: And then what do we need to do in the future to make sure that we’re still training our athletes safely and not putting them in harm’s

[00:44:02] Eric: way? Yeah, it’s a bridge from advocacy. I think our biggest area. That we have demonstrated growth is that we have more resources now than ever before. I think our biggest gap is our ability to deliver those resources tactfully in our, in our, at our institutions in a way that optimizes safety and our role in that process.

[00:44:32] Eric: And so think about, um, you know, we talk a lot about return from periods of returning from periods of inactivity, uh, summer break, it may not be a period of inactivity, but it’s a period of different activity. A lot of times if athletes are home or they, they go on break, uh. Heat illness, we were just talking about that, you know, heat illness, uh, rhabdo, all, all these different major health issues.

[00:44:59] Eric: We need to be on point with that. We have a ton of resources from the NSCA and throughout the field that you can take to your institution and advocate for whatever the gaps are that you have, whether it’s staffing, oversight, supervision, these different things that you need. So I think that’s an area where, uh.

[00:45:23] Eric: You know where we’re strong, but we still can continue to grow. And some of these issues are, I don’t think they ever go away. You know, we never want an athlete to drop dead on the field or to have a debilitating injury that takes them out of sport or off the field. It is, I mean, that’s not okay for me.

[00:45:42] Eric: It’s not okay for our profession to stand by that. Uh, and so those are the big ones, I think on a even higher level, when we look at an area we. I believe we need to continue to grow and is ensuring that appropriate qualifications are in place for roles to, it’s not just leveling the playing field, it’s create, it’s raising the floor.

[00:46:14] Eric: It’s raising the floor of our profession. And it goes back. I’ve said it a few times about professionalism. If you think about in, in anyone listening times where you’ve seen growth in our field. I can guarantee you that the steps to get there were aligned with professionalism. Someone was leading the charge, and they were a true professional, whether that was going to their AD or going to, uh, going to speak into their athletes.

[00:46:48] Eric: They were doing their job in the most professional way possible. Professionalism is second to none in this, in any job. You know, we’re not unique in that you’re not going to go work down at Bank of America and pull some of the stuff that we see in strength and conditioning. I’ll tell you that. So I think it’s something that there are areas there that are really simple fixes for a lot of our profession, you know, in areas of professionalism, but on the way we from the NSCA try to bring that to light is raising the floor of credentialing of.

[00:47:28] Eric: Qualifications for roles, working with the professional sports leagues to ensure that those athletes have the highest level of care, uh, in training and safety, safety means a lot of different things now might be protecting their information, their personal and their privacy, uh, around certain things. And, uh, you know, there’s a lot of things changing.

[00:47:52] Eric: So, you know, that, that. It’s important to me to say these things because that’s at the core of when, why is, why do we do what we do, why, and not just why do we care about strength and conditioning. Yeah, I mean at my core I believe strength and conditioning is important 365 days a year. We don’t train our athletes 365 days a year, but it’s important because of the impact we have as a community.

[00:48:20] Eric: And building that into culture a little bit more, our campus culture, our, um, legislation, our, you know, regulatory bodies, NCAA, NAIA. These are challenging steps. These are, we, you know, there’s, it’s going to take a lot of professionalism to get there. So, um, get me fired up coach. I am, uh, um, I like talking about that.

[00:48:46] Eric: So I appreciate the question. No, that’s,

[00:48:48] Donnie: uh, my heart beats the same. I always. Use a kind of a funny analogy with your topic. Could you imagine getting on an airplane, you’re gonna do a 15, 16 hour flight, you get on the plane, look at the pilots, he’s got his hat on backwards, big old dip in, hat shaved in two weeks, he got flip flops on, shorts.

[00:49:10] Donnie: You know, he’s kind of got, got his beats on, you know, and like, these are, these are the pilots that I’m about to put my life in their hands, you know, that this, I think, you know, we need to have, to your point, I echo your sentiments is like, we need to have that level of professionalism that we would expect, expect from a pilot or a banker or a high level surgeon, exactly the same.

[00:49:34] Donnie: And strength and conditioning and performance culture. And again, we’re not there yet for sure. We got a ways to go, but kudos coach to you. That’s spot on. So appreciate it.

[00:49:48] Joe: Well, cool. And you say,

[00:49:48] Donnie: whoops, wrong plane, right? Oh, planes, you know, a different plane, but I’ll find my bags later. All right. We’re, we’re getting kind of close to time here.

[00:49:57] Donnie: Um, I want to kind of finish on one of my favorite topics here. Uh, co chair, you have a beautiful family, uh, your lovely wife, Meredith, and you have four kids. And again, I can’t remember their ages, 10 and younger. I know that. And Collins, you’re your oldest son, one boy and three girls coach. How do you lead at such a high level, but stay grounded as a husband and as a, as a father, give us your insight.

[00:50:21] Donnie: Well,

[00:50:21] Eric: I’ll, I’ll play it safe here. Yeah. Like any good husband. I, I have to give a lot of credit to my wife, you know, just putting up with the coaching lifestyle. Uh, she’s followed me, uh, from the Northeast all the way around the country, multiple times. Uh, we’re from the East Coast and I keep moving her more and more West, which wasn’t intended, but it just, you know, this is just how this goes.

[00:50:47] Eric: Um, yeah, it’s really, I knew having a family was important to me early in my. Before my career even started, I know, but at that time, you don’t really know what that’s going to look like. And, um, you know, I only had, you know, to me and me and one brother growing up and now I have four kids. So. It’s a little out of my comfort zone.

[00:51:10] Eric: You know, when I’m talking, we kind of progress from man to man to plan zone. Now we’re just in like prevent, you know, I just don’t want to get beat deep with the, with the little one, you know, and, and, you know, it’s busy. And, uh, but one thing I always try to put people at ease or, you know, I, you know, when you have a lot of kids in a profession like this, it becomes kind of your thing and people are like, how do you do it?

[00:51:33] Eric: You know? But I always try to put people at ease in my wife taught me. This is, you know, we all have fears about having Children. We all have fears about taking steps in that, you know, the personal areas of our life, you know, career is pretty sequential and and you can you can work through those things and it’s not as personal to you.

[00:52:02] Eric: So those fears. You’re never really ready to have kids and she told me that before we had our first one. It’s like, oh, I want to wait till I have this or, uh, we’re doing a little better or we have a house or whatever it may be. And my personal opinion, I encourage people to, to not be as, as nervous about some of those, some of those areas.

[00:52:29] Eric: I mean, I think you have to make good decisions for you, but. I, I, I encourage people to live their life and, and take their relationships where they go. Uh, kids, having young kids right now, it’s hectic, it’s busy, but it is truly one of the most rewarding experience to, to be their dad. And, uh, they were all tackling me this morning, you know, before, and, uh.

[00:52:53] Eric: You know, my, my wife, she, you know, when I tell her I’m having a podcast, she’ll, she’ll take the kids out to the playground or whatever it is for, for an hour or so. So, so they, they’ve kind of built this routine now where, you know, the kids are saying goodbye and there’s no better feeling as a father than, you know, a three year old or even a 10 year old, my son, you know, running up to you and giving you a big hug and telling them they love you.

[00:53:18] Eric: And, and, uh, it’s. It truly means a lot to me to be present on both fronts. Uh, that’s hard for everybody. It’s challenging. I said before, work life balance isn’t, isn’t a, uh, it’s not a perfect formula. And so I, I just try to be as good as I can be, coach. Coach, you, uh,

[00:53:40] Donnie: thank you for sharing that. I mean, again, in my humble opinion and professional experience over the years of doing this, You look for leaders in our profession, not just that are great leaders in in our industry, but I think most importantly to me as a coach, I look for great husbands and fathers and wives and mothers that are leading in this profession because to me, those the amount of pressure and weight that you carry and here’s the key, right?

[00:54:09] Donnie: The amount of selflessness that you got to have, not just as a as a parent and as a spouse, But also, uh, as a coach and educator and motivator with me working with people. So coach, you’re doing a great job. I know it’s not perfect, but keep striving to be that, that great, uh, family man. We appreciate it.

[00:54:28] Eric: Well, you’re, you’re, I know you have, you have four kids, right, Donnie? Yes, sir. And, and there are a few years ahead of mine, so I definitely look up to you. And, uh, it’s. You know, it’s, it’s a journey, uh, you know, 10, 7, 5, 3, I’m writing thick of it now, but it’s, uh, I appreciate, I appreciate you bringing that up.

[00:54:49] Eric: It means a lot to me to talk about it.

[00:54:53] Joe: Oh, Shannon, I’m, I’m right behind you. I have one at 19 months, so I’m, I’m tag along, bring up the rear here. Um, but before we go coach, I just want to ask you if, if anyone wanted to, uh, look you up or find you on social media, where, where can our listeners find you?

[00:55:07] Eric: Yeah, so I’m on Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn, uh, my handle across the board is ericmcmanncscs.

[00:55:15] Eric: Uh, so, um, I’m pretty easy to find on that. And then you can drop my email, NSCA email in the show notes as well. Uh, the, uh, eric. mcmann at nsca. com. So hopefully I’m easy to track down. And I, uh, you know, I enjoy connecting with people on, on anything we talked about today and then some, so really appreciate it.

[00:55:42] Eric: It’s the, well,

[00:55:42] Donnie: that’s it from, uh, for our podcast today. Everybody, that’s the team behind the team. Coach Eric, thank you so much. Again, if you have not met coach Eric, reach out to him, connect with him, social media, if not go to nsa. com, right? Correct. Coach. All the resources, conferences, educational materials they have.

[00:56:04] Donnie: There is absolutely amazing coach. When’s your next conference coming up?

[00:56:08] Eric: So we have tactical, the tactical stranding conditioning conference coming up end of August. Uh, we’re actually about to. I’ll let the cat out of the bag here. We’re going to have a three T’s training, testing, and tracking sports science clinic.

[00:56:25] Eric: It’s going to be virtual available online early December. Uh, uh, and I skipped over one, uh, the, uh, personal training virtual clinic in October. So we have a few, this is it’s conference season now, so we’re, we’re doing it.

[00:56:40] Donnie: Good stuff. Well, hey, again, if you have not checked it out, please go to their website, look up everything that got going on there.

[00:56:47] Donnie: And it’s amazing. Coach Eric, thank you again. Coach Joe. It’s good to see you again on the podcast. I know you’ve been out for a little vacay and other stuff and hope the family is doing well. And that’s it from the team behind the team podcast. Here in Austin, Texas. We’ll catch you on the flip side. Hook em.

[00:57:04] Donnie: Hook em. Thanks so much for tuning in and listening to this episode of the team Behind the Team podcast. For future episodes, go to iTunes, Spotify, Google Podcast, or Stitcher. We definitely want to keep having great guests on the show and great content, so if you have a moment, please go to iTunes, leave a rating and review and let us know how we’re doing.

[00:57:28] Donnie: I’m Donnie Mae, and thanks so much for tuning in.