E18 | Bonus episode: Coaches Round Table with Dan Pfaff and Loren Landow

[0:00:01 Speaker 2] Welcome to the team behind the team podcast. I’m your host, don t may. This is the monthly show focused on building conversations around the team based model approach to ethics, performance, strength and conditioning, sports, medicine, sports, science, mental health and wellness and sports nutrition. Well, hello, everybody, and welcome to the 2000 and 21 University of Texas Athletic Performance Coaches Roundtable. My name is Dani. Maybe I’m the head coach for athletic performance for Olympic sports and in the House today. We’ve got two guests will introduce in just a moment. But first and foremost, I want to pass the mic over to our clinic director and assistant coach at Texas coach Anna Craig. Hello, coach.

[0:00:49 Speaker 3] Thank you, Dani. Um, we’re happy to have our guests here today, But just to introduce myself, I’ve been an athletic performance coach at the University of Texas for the past nine years. I specifically work with women’s soccer, women’s tennis and diving, and I’m also the director of our annual clinic. So unfortunately, due to covid concerns, we have had to cancel our 2021 January clinic. But we’re hopeful to be back in January 2022 so as a thank you to our annual clinic attendees and still in the interest of putting out quality education, we are fortunate to bring in Coach Loren Landau and Coach Dan path for a roundtable discussion today. So covid has forced all of us to put a little bit of a reset on our lives and go back to kind of the fundamentals and the basics of what life is about. And so that inspired our topic today of taking us back to the fundamentals of training. So today we’re gonna be asking our coaches How do we go back to the basics in training? How do we go back to the fundamentals and remember to not fear too far away from those things?

[0:02:04 Speaker 2] Coach Craig, thank you so much for that introduction. And I’m gonna do just a brief intro just to save time, because we want to hear from these guys. But I just want to do a quick bio for Coach Dan Path and Lauren Landel. First and foremost, you know, uh, just a little behind the scenes when we were talking about not having a clinic. These two coaches are world renowned. Uh, they’re experts in our field and profession. They’re highly respected individuals and very sought after globally. So they were the top of the mind top of our discussion when we could not have a clinic. Who’s the best of the best? These two guys we wanted to go after and they were gracious and kind enough to give us some time today. So little quick snippets of these guys, uh, Coach Dan path a little bit more personal. I had the pleasure of working with Dan here at the University of Texas for several years and was able to be, I would say, a little shadow in his hip most of the time. I would say that would be the correct picture. Would you say that Coach path? Uh, man, I learned so much from him. Not just about. I think about performance, but, uh, you know just how to treat people and how to dialogue and connect. And everybody’s so different how to motivate, uh, coach path. Obviously, just to save time, he’s I mean, world renowned coach. So many different Olympians, uh, has consulted with many, many institutions, has his own business now consulting and works with all kinds of athletes all over the world. So coach path Welcome. And glad to have you here today.

[0:03:35 Speaker 1] Thanks. Anxious to trap? Yes,

[0:03:38 Speaker 2] sir. Uh, Coach Landel just a little bit about him. He’s very similar to coach Path again. I’ll let them get into in a second there. There are good friends and associates, and I know Coach Path is has definitely mentor coach. Land out through the years, so you’ll hear a lot of influence. Uh, coming from him from coach path coach. Land out. Very equally successful. He’s currently with the Denver Broncos as their head strength coach and the director of performance there, um, again has his own built his own facility. Landau performance in Denver. Uh, has worked with multiple, uh, athletes in the UFC realm again. Lots of things I could say about him. I want to briefly just say, over the years, I’ve had the chance of hearing him just like coach path in a different vein, but clinics, But most importantly, I’ve had a chance to sit. I want them in person and visit with him. Great guy humble, um and knows his nose. This profession forward and backwards. Great at real people skills just like Coach Path knows how to interact with people across different, uh, different modalities and training philosophies. And so I think that’s what makes both these guys phenomenal humans, but even better coaches. So without further ado, let’s kick this off. And guys, Coach Landau, welcome. Good to have you here.

[0:04:54 Speaker 0] Thank you, guys. Thank you very much. And it’s an honor to be on with you guys and coach path.

[0:04:58 Speaker 2] Yes, sir. All right. We’ll jump right in. Coach. Coach Craig, kick us off on our 2021 round table. Here we go. All

[0:05:04 Speaker 3] right, So, to give a little bit of context for our listeners, can you to talk about how your paths crossed and the relationship that you have had over the years, and I’m gonna have coach path start us out on that one

[0:05:17 Speaker 1] at my age is a memory gets kind of scattered, but I think our first connection was through a couple of Denver Bronco players that Lauren worked with in the off season. And either it was injuries or running related. Somehow they migrated to Texas, and I did some work and that started the dialogue. And this is back before text and Internet. So it was phone calls and fax machines and, uh, a little more difficult exchange of ideas back then. It is now for sure.

[0:05:56 Speaker 0] Yeah, over the years, Coach path and I discuss sharing projects. And I was introduced to coach through these athletes, and they were getting these workouts via fax machine. And I was doing my best to try to transcribe, understand? Maybe what? What? What? His philosophy was going into the exercise. I was implementing his work. Um, but, you know, at the end of the day, I could see the brilliance. I was like, I need to talk to I need to get to know this person and see really where this is going. Um, Coach Pass path may not remember this, but about 20 years ago as well, I was invited down to the University of Texas with the Seattle Seahawks with the strength coach at the time. At that time, Ken Johnston and I was a guest and I got to watch Coach path in action with about 15 to 20 of those Seahawks players, and just to what Coach Donnie said was, listen to how he communicated, how he talked and just how subtle he was as a coach and the things he picked up on, um, those were That was really how our relationship started. And to be honest with you, it’s the best thing that’s happened in my career. Was getting to know Coach Path and where we are today.

[0:07:08 Speaker 1] Awesome.

[0:07:09 Speaker 3] Well, after that, I just kind of wanted to ask you guys, How did you get into the field to begin with and specifically for you? Coach path. I know, originating in track and field. What particularly piqued your interest about the performance side and kind of went off of just being specifically track and field.

[0:07:31 Speaker 1] Well, I grew up in the Midwest in a rural area in in in the sixties, and so that was an arrow where you played whatever sport was in season. You had multiple coaches. We didn’t have clubs or travel teams or whatever. A lot of pickup games like frozen ponds. We played hockey, you know, it was really bad. Weather went downstairs and wrestled in the basement, so I was kind of a generalist in terms of sport introduction and and then I became a school teacher and I taught all the sciences, physics, chemistry, electronics, biology and I had to coach everything. I was offensive coordinator and football. I was wrestling Coach. I was inter mural director track coach. I knew how to tape ankle, so I was the A T. C. This is before a T. C. Was even a profession because my track background I knew a little bit about lifting weights. So I became the weight room guy, too. So my whole life I grew up as a farmer and my dad owned construction company. So my whole life was being a generalist, wearing a lot of hats, seeking advice, putting schemes together. So I was pretty fortunate how it all started.

[0:08:51 Speaker 3] Do you feel like that diverse background made you a lot of the coach that you are today? Do you feel like you pulled from the chemistries and the coaching and teaching a lot of different sports and topics?

[0:09:04 Speaker 1] For sure, I think the science background taught me how to be a discriminating consumer of information and topics and philosophies and whatnot. I think being a farmer and a construction person, uh, there’s no way you can know everything, but you learn real quick who to go to in what areas. So if it was a plumbing problem or electrical problem or framing or pouring slab or roofing? Yeah, I knew I wasn’t clever, but I knew who were the best guy was on the job. And so that’s who I studied under. So I think I was really fortunate to grow up the way that I did. And for sure, being a generalist for me was the only way. Like I said, I was an average student. Uh, State University graduate degree was kind of a slap together degrees, and my whole life has been just kind of pulling from a lot of spheres of influence to create, you know, a current philosophy or operational method. Mhm

[0:10:06 Speaker 3] coach. Land out. Did you have a pretty different experience or how did you get into the field?

[0:10:12 Speaker 0] I love sports, played, uh, you know, three sport athlete. Growing up through high school, I fell in love with the weight room and I was making my way to college. I’m like, What am I going to do? I didn’t know what I want to do school wise, and I was an average athlete. I was an average student and a friend of mine was enrolled in exercise physiology program and started telling me about. I’m like, Wait a minute, I can actually make a living preparing and training athletes So I went that route while I was in college. Um, you know, when coming out of my degree, I ended up going into cardiac and pulmonary rehab, and I did that. I took that as my first step out of college and did it for a bit of time, not a full calendar year. And after about about probably 9 to 10 months on the job with that, I was like, Okay, I’ve got to get into training someone athletes. General Pops didn’t even matter at this point, so I did. I got into like, athletic club setting and just started getting my hands on middle school and high school age athletes and just trying to figure out this thing of training, and that’s really kind of what led to it and then going into business, I was an operations manager and athletic director of this athletic club, and then that moved forward into other facilities and ultimately where I took it to in owning my own facility. And now to where I am today with the Denver Broncos. And I would say the most unique thing people say, What was the biggest skill set you had going into being the head strength conditioning coach? I said, owning a business owning a business because as a business owner, you have to find win win strategies at all costs. And I think to be a successful strength coach, you have to have win win, and you have to be able to play nice in the sandbox with a lot of different, Um, a lot of different, um, departments so they don’t turn silo mhm.

[0:12:04 Speaker 3] Something that’s interesting about both your experiences is how you have experience in other areas and pull that into being in performance. So,

[0:12:16 Speaker 1] yeah, I think I get asked this all the time by young coaches or young therapist. And my number one recommendation is spend a year at a public school. Yeah, learn to deal with school boards and parents and principals and peers and problem kids and unique environments. There’s for me. I’m so blessed to have been in public school teacher for six years. The battles, hurdles, obstacles and lessons from tons of failure or priceless.

[0:12:52 Speaker 2] You see a lot of just even coach path to iterate reiterate that like Coach Wooden was a high school coach, wouldn’t I

[0:12:58 Speaker 1] think, you

[0:12:59 Speaker 2] know what I mean? Some of the best, most influential coaches, they start off with the younger kids in high school, and then they just they tend to go up and just having a, I think, an ability to teach and make really complex concepts and subjects really simple, digestible and applicable. So I think that’s a big piece of y’all success. But that success, it kinda is intertwined. It’s pretty cool. Cool, uh, for our topic today. Our discussion is really simple, right? Its foundations and fundamentals of coaching and performance. Coaches know and value how important building a good foundation with their athletes is for performance. So for you guys, how would you go about instilling, um, solid foundations and fundamentals at the level the high level athletes you guys work with? How would you go about doing that?

[0:13:55 Speaker 0] What’s bad if you want to start that?

[0:13:57 Speaker 1] Sure, I think it starts with a thorough and layered in spectral debris for induction process. So what’s their past history. What’s your injury history? What’s what are they battling chronically? What are their strengths and what are their weaknesses? What do they like to do? What do they dislike to do? What is previous coaches or experienced said about their wheelhouse and how they operate current organization? I mean, what are the demands? The expectations? What support groups do I have around these people? All these are variables that you have to really lock down before you even begin to talk about the step forward.

[0:14:45 Speaker 2] I like one point right real quick before you go, Coach Landel. But you hit a nerve right there. What they like and don’t like. I mean today. Well, I tell you what the You know, people talk about the golden rule. I think you always I think the platinum rule. You treat others how they want to be treating, finding out kind of how they like their steak a little bit, so to speak as a metaphor. You know, I think that that helps kinda, and I’m and I’ve heard that from NFL coaches before to coach land out that you’ve got to find out kind of what these guys will sink their teeth into So love that answer, Coach.

[0:15:19 Speaker 0] Yeah, and I I think from my perspective, you know, I look at it every year. Um, when we get the rookie class coming in, you know, you kind of start to get an idea of what they like. What? They don’t like what what somebody was able to get away with in the weight room where they were, maybe at collegiately, who ran, maybe a stricter and tighter ship. The one thing that I’m noticing with some of these kids coming in now is there’s really a lack of saturation of training and and being the fundamentals. I think a lot of these kids before they come to us to us, they have just gone through their combine, prep their all their entire NFL draft prep. And so they did all the special training for this one day. And then people said, Okay, we’ll see you later, and they didn’t necessarily prepare for a season. So when guys, when players come to us, uh, work capacities are low, a lot of training age seems to be really low right now that we’re seeing. And I think it’s because such of this specific model that’s being put out there, where there’s just not a good, deep saturation of, uh, fundamental work. Uh

[0:16:26 Speaker 3] huh. With those high level athletes, how do you show them the necessity for the fundamentals of training? So when they do come in with some of those, um, deficiencies, if you will, or some of those areas they still need to be built up in, how do you prove to them that there, maybe on a B and C and not on X, Y and Z, where they thought maybe they were?

[0:16:50 Speaker 1] Well, for me, it always starts with what is their position demands and where they currently operating at. So you got to define. Here’s what you need to do in your sport or in your game or at your position. And here are reports on what you’re good at. What you’re bad at. Here are some metrics and so on and so forth. And then I’m kind of like a Philadelphia lawyer. I try to build a case and the athletes like a jury, and so I’ll have examples. Here’s what 10 all pro guys a year position have done at various stages of their career. Here’s some of their metrics. Here’s some of the comments on their strengths, their weaknesses, how they approached it. I think it’s real easy to get caught up identifying weaknesses and trying to go all in on that, and I think that’s a huge mistake. Our philosophy is identify strengths, polish that car daily, if possible, and slowly nudge these gaps and weaknesses. But for them to acknowledge they got a weakness, if they don’t know what’s come on before them or what’s expected or what are the metrics, then then you’re fighting with one arm tied behind your back. So knowledge of the essentials knowledge of the fundamental I’ll ask strength coaches. What are 12 fundamental movements that you think are important? A lot of them stop after five

[0:18:18 Speaker 0] mhm

[0:18:19 Speaker 1] so we don’t even know what the chess pieces are.

[0:18:25 Speaker 2] Yeah, they don’t have. Like you said, they don’t have the knowledge, the knowledge, but the the training base to pull from. Um, But I think, too, that that goes back to, you know, like like coach Coach Landau. You’re saying you’re seeing all these basically these gaps, these guys coming in and got some fundamental gaps that haven’t been addressed you gotta You almost kind of got to go backwards a little bit first. Probably. I think you kind of try to catch him up a little bit. Would you say that, Coach?

[0:18:53 Speaker 0] I’d say it goes back to what Coach pass, as it depends on who the player is. If I’ve got an incoming rookie and I know I’ve got time to develop them, it’s perfect. But if he is expected to play right away, it’s really tough to fill in some of those gaps when they’re taking these live bullets. So kind of like Coach passed, you know, same idea. I kind of drip feed it, you know? Hey, you know what? You do a really good job. You know who you remind me of. You remind me of this player and when this player came to me, here’s the things that we did because I see some commonalities in deficiency or an ability, and they like to be compared. One thing I know about elites, they love to be compared. They love to hear what they do. Well, I feed them a lot of what you do well, and then I’ll start to kind of nudge them a little bit like Coach said about, you know, here’s where I think you could develop your game even better. If we did this, I think you’d be more durable. I think you’d be quicker. I think you’d be faster in and out of your brakes. Those types of things, build them up, build them up, and then give them a little bit of that critical aspect I have found. If you come at some of the elites to harden on the negative side, they’re going to tune you out, right? Wrong or indifferent, They’re going to tune you out. A lot of times

[0:20:07 Speaker 1] in this generation of kids, it’s just been raised with cheerleaders there in these travel teams, these elite clubs, they were the best kid on their high school team. They were all American in college, so they have had smoke blown up their ass from Day one. So for them to encounter constructive criticism, it might be the first time in their life someone’s challenged them On that front.

[0:20:32 Speaker 2] I had a quick little question to both of your guys’ points or just kind of another layer, so I I totally I hear what you’re saying and feel you. So now how do you take that? What you just said and communicate that to a head coach in a way that they will understand it and be able to digest it, because that’s I mean, me and Coach Craig and probably performance coaches understand what you’re saying. But how do you take that to a head coach who’s maybe got pressure on him? His job’s on the line. Yada, yada, yada. How do you handle that?

[0:21:06 Speaker 0] Yeah, yeah, that’s the challenging part. And that’s the job that I always say we get paid for and we’re gonna figure it out. But at the end of the day, I think the biggest thing that we do, Donnie, as we try to fill in those gaps, if I have an incoming wide receiver who’s maybe a little bit light and body weight, I’ve got to do my darndest to show that I’m putting on lean Mass and I’m getting him in the certain areas of these windows. The unique thing is I do feel I’ve got a strong relationship with different coaches on our team that I can give feedback. Hey, you want wait on this player but this player moves really, really well, My concern is if we put too much weight on this player too soon, what made him special isn’t gonna be special anymore. So we have to be careful how we make these numerical gains or fill these gaps numerically, whatever that thing is. If it’s a body weight thing, you know how it is where coaches are fixated on a number and I have to sit there. And I have to be the accident of it saying, Look, I get bigger, faster, stronger. But that doesn’t always equate. So with this player, we need time to develop them so we don’t lose. Why you drafted them?

[0:22:11 Speaker 1] Mhm. Yeah.

[0:22:14 Speaker 3] So a lot of our attendees for the clinic are high school strength coaches, high school sport coaches, private sector coaches, developmental coaches. So if you could be your athletes strength coach back in high school or back in the private sector when they are being developed to go into college sports, Um what? What are you doing fundamentally to make up for some of the gaps that you’re seeing exposed later on?

[0:22:46 Speaker 1] Well, I think you have to have a good evaluation or screening process start out. So how do you come up with even this concept of strengths and weaknesses and abilities, So you have to put them through various movement expressions and activities, closed chain and open chain, maybe reference previous coaches from wherever they’re at developmentally, I think a point that’s often missed is strength. Training should be an adjunct to their sport. It shouldn’t be a driver. And I think this is where a lot of well meaning strength coaches get lost. They they become the center of the universe, and their activities drive the process depending on the sport. The weight an agile. It’s a supportive measure. It’s it’s an adult tweaker. It’s an influencer, not a driver. The sport office, the driver. And I think it’s easy to get lost in that scenario.

[0:23:51 Speaker 0] Mhm. And I think for me, Coach Craig, when I’m looking at some of those younger athletes, they’ve got to have great movement literacy, Uh, you know the ability to skip, hop and and and have rhythm to it and relaxation and be able to do things fluidly and relaxed and know how to bend and swerve and and D cell like those things to me are critical. That’s critical for high performance. I see so many other coaches are a lot of coaches in our field that will think that you can develop a lot of things in the weight room, and I really don’t think you can. I think that you can have some icing on the cake. But I also think that in some cases that can actually make the athletes move worse. So to me it’s the ability to have a foundation of movement expression, as coach said. But movement in all planes, the ability start Stop hop, stick gallop, you name it, do it. Things that express coordination to me are paramount, and then we just add the icing on the cake with the strength. Now, obviously depending on like our kpi is like, you know, if I’m looking at an offensive lineman versus wide receiver, there’s some different kpi s there, and I need you to spend a lot of time saturating the weight room. Those offensive lineman better be able to bend. They better be able to have those movement expressions as well. So to me it’s almost like a gradient of where do I spend my time but they all should get. They all should get the stuff. It’s just a matter of who should get more of what stuff that makes sense. It

[0:25:19 Speaker 3] does. And I like your point of developing. Sometimes we forget we’re developing athletes and not weightlifters. Sometimes we under emphasis the athleticism over all of the athletes. Um, so in that what are some of the lenses that you look through when prescribing protocols and regiments for your differing sports and athletes? So when you are looking at the importance of the weight room versus conditioning versus speed, what are some of the things that you look at for different sports?

[0:25:54 Speaker 1] I think first and foremost, you need to have a background in the sport that you’re dealing with. So if you’re a strength coach and you’re dealing with multiple sports, you’ve got to become a student of those sports. So what you do with an ice hockey player versus a field hockey player versus a volleyball player versus a swimmer? Those are different spheres of influence, so understanding the sport is for me is the kind of the first layer. The second layer is like Lauren was talking about what what do they look like? In movement, expression, open and closed chain on multiple movement task. Whether it’s running, it’s jumping. It’s starting stopping its cutting its change in direction. How are they those activities? And then the next layer is digging into the actual entity that you’re exploring so we can talk speed, for example. Is there a gap in starting strength? Is there a gap in understanding how to execute mechanics during acceleration? Is there a problem with transitioning from Accel to upright running in their sport? Do they spend much time upright running? So you know you have these layers and spectrums to the activity, and and that should then circle back and influence in my mind what you’re programming and from a programming standpoint, frequency of these activities types of these activities, but a big black hole that Isis people are designing weight room programs, and they don’t understand how that’s affecting fieldwork or sports specific work. So they may do a great job in the weight room, but then they’re crushed for two days. Coordinative Lee. Well, how’s that moving the ball forward on the basketball court? Mhm,

[0:27:46 Speaker 0] Yeah, And to piggyback on that going back to First of all, what’s the sport? What’s the position played and what is the event in this sport? If we’re looking at swimmers and track and field like you have to look at those things and then what? Once you identify those things, what are the What is the current athlete have in your in their kpi s? What do they have when you look at their needs analysis And where are their their individual gaps? What is the sport? What’s the position played within the sport? Who is the person in front of me? What are there gaps? What are their What are their strengths? Um, but you know, the same same kind of concept. I think that there are so many people who are, um I can admit to this When I first started working with my mm a guys, you know, I’m putting them on some great great lower body strength work on their Monday’s elastic strength day. Their head coach called me up, said Man, all of our fighters look horrible at wrestling on Monday. Yeah, I screwed them up, and so I I learned that I’ve got to make sure that whatever I implement I don’t screw up the technical tactical practices. If I do that, they’re going to be worse at their position. They’re gonna be worse at the coordination patterns that I just talked about. They’re going to be worse than defending themselves or trying to take somebody down. So for me, I I took it upon myself to sit there and say We’ve got to find a better way to work around the week that I don’t interfere whatsoever with any of the technical and tactical coaches And and I hold the same thing true in the NFL, like I’ve got to be smart. The the, uh, We’ve got to be smart when we do certain things, because if I inhibit any bit of practice, or if I aid to somebody going on to the injury list, that’s a bad thing. That’s a bad thing if I did it in my session or not, even in my session. But the accumulative fatigue led to that because I wasn’t thinking

[0:29:38 Speaker 2] I had a quick, quick thing here because both of you guys just you triggered something in me Coach path. I don’t know if you admit you were probably won the first coach. Is it really, um, just mess and tweaked my thinking on on, like, one of our all time. What would you call it? It’s like a hollow ground lifts as a strength coach. And it was the squat and, you know, depend on who you talk to in our profession, right? You’ve got some people that believe, and this is a topic for our staff will get into it as well. Sometimes. About what’s good Squad death. Do you squat? Do you not squat? And so I think you know. Then I remember you. You you were talking to me about one of your world class sprinters. You probably You’ve known so many people on top of that, do you probably remember this, but you’re just talking about squatting and that, like, at certain times of year, you shouldn’t squat. And I think like that because of the scar tissue and the and the tightness it creates in the legs and, you know, shortens their stride length and could cause injuries down the road. So I think that’s a prime example. You know, just not being able to think outside the box. And then you showed me several exercises that were We’re just as effective but still accomplished and checking that box. So to your point, if you remember any of that, But

[0:30:55 Speaker 1] I do, it’s a common conversation.

[0:30:59 Speaker 2] Good stuff, Coach. Uh, let’s go into our next question and shift gears a little bit in your head. We’re gonna talk a little bit about programming for a moment, and you kind of each of you have already kind of touched on your evaluations and things like that. How you would break down an athlete of what? Where they’re at, what they need. Gaps. Um, mhm. Talk about when you’re writing a program. Once you’ve kind of done some of that. Where do you go from there when you’re prescribing and starting to write down a blueprint for an athlete kind of talk about that thought process that you have?

[0:31:37 Speaker 1] Well, some of it depends on what the program involves. So am I. The laid coach. Am I the gatekeeper? I’m writing all of the program or am I just writing a bridge part of the program? So, as a track coach, I wrote everything you know when I’m working with an NFL guy on a return to play project. I’m working. I may be working through a guy like Lauren, who is his strength coach and performance director, his position coach, the head coach, the schedule. They’ve got the days of the week, how they practice, what they do. There is a lot of balls that I’m juggling, so I’ve got to know the turf and my job before I even start the process.

[0:32:26 Speaker 2] That’s good. Yeah, that’s a lot of pieces there.

[0:32:28 Speaker 1] Yeah,

[0:32:30 Speaker 0] in for mine in my current situation is, you know what time of year is it and how much time do I have in this current time? And then, ultimately, who controls the bulk of the work load? Just like Coach said in the off season program. Dani, I control everything right. I control everything. They’re spending their time with me, and then as we go into what I just considered our off season program, they’ll spend start time and strength conditioning. Then we’ll hybrid strength, conditioning and a little bit of on field work. And then by our last phase of the off season program, they’re doing fieldwork and strength conditioning. Um, when I get into season, you know what’s happening on the field is priority, and so, at different times a year, I look at different programming and period ization strategies. In my off season program, I’ll do a block style model in my in my summer bridge. I’ll do a weekly undulated model and then in my in season model, because I am no longer the gatekeeper of time and truly 90% of their exposure workload. Then, in season, I do a daily undulated model where I’ll do a dynamic effort, Day Max, Strength Day and a repeat effort day. And so I’ll just touch on those three qualities throughout the week for retention purposes.

[0:33:48 Speaker 1] I think Lauren brings up another really good point here, and this is a battle, and I consult with performance people all over the world and all kinds of sports, and in this tug of war comes up in every conversation, and it’s called development mindset or paradigm and management mindset. In paradigm and in sport, we have to wear both hats. We have to juggle those balls so, as Lauren said, at certain times of the year or stage of career development has a higher driver index, if you will. But at other times the year or other stages of development. Its management. If I’ve got a 38 year old wide receiver, it’s not about development. It’s about management.

[0:34:36 Speaker 2] Coach Pat to kind of kind of jump on that. I’ve heard you talk about this before. Conferences about period ization. I mean, what’s your thoughts on modern period ization? Is privatization there? Is it? I mean, give it. Give me your thoughts. I’d love to hear your thoughts on land Coach land out. You two here in a second. But coach, lead us off on

[0:34:54 Speaker 1] that missile started Social media firestorm. Every time we see somebody on as the Internet trolls come out of the woodwork for me, I’m a high school teacher. And so back in the day, we had to write lesson plans and your first year you had to turn them into the principal. So you have to have a six week plan, a weekly plan and a daily plan and the principal and say how that will work or this won’t work or whatever. So it was really a plan. Well, period, ization to me is a lesson plan. Now. A lot of the classic period is a national science came from Eastern Bloc, where it was drug driven and drug influenced and drivers and whatnot. But I think we’re getting into tribalism and semantics, planning versus program, and you get into those two camps. Do we do certain things at different times of the year? Yes, well, different times of year, our periods. So whether it’s in season or off season or, you know, a workday or a recovery day, there’s labels that we put on certain blocks of time. And we manipulate our programming, our ideas, our kpi s to fit those particular periods. So for me, period ization isn’t dead. It’s just misunderstood. And tribalism has created an interesting debate at 10 o’clock at night on Twitter. Yeah.

[0:36:37 Speaker 2] Mhm. What are your thoughts, Coach Landau?

[0:36:40 Speaker 0] You know, I I you know, obviously we all grew up, and we’re all trying to understand and figure out this thing. Privatization and the more complex And the more, um, technical outlook, that means that you must know your stuff and or you have at least told enough people. And I think really training is pretty simple in the mindset of, uh, you know, what time do you How much time do you have? Do you control the abundance of workload? And what’s the adaptation rate of the person in front of you? That’s the moving target that none of us know, so we can create all these great paradise and structured plans. But what this stimulus does to this person, what this stimulus does to another person. The rate of adaptation is so different. Do we need to have something that structure, especially in a team setting where it can’t just be like, Hey, do whatever you want today for sure, but I think we have to have a really good understanding of a con current model where we’re developing multiple quality simultaneously. I’m fortunate when I’ve got a lot of elite athletes who can handle that. I’ll tell you what. The funniest thing that I realized when I started working with the uh with the Broncos was a lot is you can go classical models, so we’re gonna go to anatomical adaptation, and we’re gonna spend 3 to 4 weeks here, and we really want to increase cross sectional area. If you live at triples, these guys are going to grow. These guys develop at a different rate than normal people. So I don’t think privatization is dead. I think the rate of adaptation to each individual is completely different. And I think some things that we classically think are very biased and maybe misunderstood. As Coach Path has said, At the end of the day, you have to have a structure and you have to have a plan. And to me, that’s why I kind of I I alluded to how I do my plan. A block model. I’ll tell you exactly how I do it will start in, and I’ll give the guys a week or two of anatomical adaptation, whatever we want to call it, keep the loads like get them acclimated back into the weight room. If they haven’t been doing anything after that, I’ll transition into a strength block for about three weeks. We have a one week the load and then I’ll transition into another 3 to 4 week block where it’s a hybrid of strength and power. So even though it’s a block, I’m living in multiple things at simultaneous times, and even if I’m in a strength power block, I’ll still do retention work in a higher set rep scheme I might pull the volume way back as far as sets or the density of work. But I’m still touching on all those quality drivers that I think are important for the development of my guys, whether it’s their neurological capability, whether it’s the pure strength and power development that I’m looking for from a tissue standpoint, um, or just the cross sectional area that I’m trying to retain and restore. Good,

[0:39:19 Speaker 3] thanks. So I’m going to take that question. I’m going to zoom it in one step. So when you are looking at the structure of your programming, how do you plan out? Lifting s A Q and conditioning sessions. And how do you work that in with one another? Whether that be a block training plan or working different qualities simultaneously? How do you guys go about looking at that

[0:39:45 Speaker 1] again? It would depend on the sports stage of development. Current state of health and fitness needs analysis, uh, coach preference program philosophy. You know, there’s a lot of variables that you have to kind of have in place before you start looking at that. I’m a lot like Lauren. I’m very concurrent year round. Uh, I’m biased I don’t do a lot of general prep type stuff with elite athletes because I feel like the game and a lot of menu items that we do train those things in route. If I If I’m in season or spring camp and my ride receivers are running 40 50 routes in practice, do I need to condition? Hey, is it possible to work on speed when they’re doing that kind of workload? Probably not. Can I work on some acceleration stuff? Yeah, maybe. And warm up with a micro dose just to make sure the A b CS and the programming of what to do is there. So there’s so many variables going on at once. I’m not trying to dodge the question, but I think we’ve got to get good at looking at the ergonomics of that week and deciphering how we’re gonna manipulate these variables within the week based on energy, abilities and capacities that they currently have. I’m gonna bang this drum hard again. I truly believe that the sport itself conditions a lot of things way better than we could ever try to come up with a way from the pitch or the

[0:41:30 Speaker 0] court completely agree on that, coach. I think there’s a lot of lot of that’s missed on the conditioning side, where it’s just volume on top of volume. And and it’s the the reactive change direction of the sport that that’s where it comes. You know, you can run straight ahead all you want and do your 300. But the second you start changing direction in a phone booth or having to cover somebody, um, downfield, that’s a different animal. Uh, and a. To answer that question. As far as how I look at it, it depends on what the quality is. I’m looking for the day if I’m looking at what say it’s off season and I have complete control and I can develop acceleration Max. Velocity movement is always my number one go to in a hierarchy of order. I go movement first, and then I’ll go into my weight room. Second, I’ll bridge the weight room, usually with my my overhead. My med ball throws any type of plyometric jump. I’ll try and make that my bridge into the weight room. Um, if it’s a more of a metabolic conditioning day, where it is usually change the direction in nature. Um, again, I’ll try to avoid the weight room first, allow them to actually put their work into the field and then go into the weight room. Uh, there are times where I will say it’s a performance day and I’m looking at pure acceleration Max Velocity, where I’m not getting a lot of density of work. We’ll go in the weight room and then on maybe it’s dribbles. Maybe it’s something like that where I add in a conditioning piece later if I need to. Chances are I don’t need to. I want to spend the time on those qualities on those given days. But even if it’s a Tuesday Friday, which are more my metabolic days, I’ll lift and then do things that are very general in nature. But they don’t lead to more impact. My players are anywhere between 21 32 years of age, and I have to be cognizant of the amount of impact and toll that just running does. So I’ve got to be smart and how I stack my deck.

[0:43:35 Speaker 1] I’d like to jump in here to This is an old school guy, and I think a lot of coaches and of your generation were kinda hurt because they didn’t do multiple sports. They specialized and they know their sport real well. But for the old guys like Donny and Lauren and myself, where we played a lot of sports, here’s something I noticed. It took me three or four weeks to get in football shape, and then I was in football shape. And then when I went to basketball, I thought I was in pretty good shape. But I wasn’t in basketball shape and it took me two or three weeks to get in basketball shape. And then one year I wrestled and man, it took me a month to get in wrestling shape. And then when I went out to track, I wasn’t in shape from. I was a pole vaulter is like I’d take 10 vaults and my body was beat to crap, and I thought I was in great shape from all these other sports. So I want to re confirm what Lawrence said. The sports specificity transference of shape is very sports specific. Mhm.

[0:44:43 Speaker 3] Yeah, So if we’re looking at the absolute foundation of performance, if you let’s take a team sport, Okay. What is some advice that you would give people in regards to speed work, developing change of direction or baseline conditioning. What advice would you give people in regards to programming that?

[0:45:09 Speaker 1] Lauren, I’ll let you go first.

[0:45:10 Speaker 0] Okay. Looking at the team sports side of things again. And it comes to it comes down to me, uh, doing the con current model. And what time of year is it? If I’m in my off season, period, I’m gonna work on acceleration because to me, my sport is played in acceleration and and the thing that I’ve been chasing quite a bit over the years is Max. Speed and football is anything but Max. Speed football is about repeatability. So what I will do is I’ll work with my athletes over and over again on repeatability of acceleration technique. I’ll hammer on the general locomotion technique in marches in in a March is resistant marches a runs, and then I’ll put it to the real deal practice. But to me, it’s understanding that here’s a quality of movement that is very important for my sport. Now, how do I blend in the conditioning component to then match? That depends on the time of year. I don’t spend a I’ll do tempo runs in the offseason, but again, it’s very general in nature as we get closer into our season and I’ll still work on acceleration components. But these acceleration components are now coming out of position specific positions. My, my defensive ends. Here’s how you’re gonna punch drive mechanics and here’s how you’re gonna make it bend. And here’s what your body position should be for your position and how you do things based on your body type. If you’re if you’re running back and you know you go into what we think classically, as far as a good acceleration position, they’re gonna get blown out of the water. So you have to prepare people for impact. You have to prepare them. Say, look, these are the mechanics I want, and here’s how they change as we go. I never once tell them you should run like this. I give them the foundations in the early off season, and then I just let it happen. If I see something that’s glaring where it’s too much of a technical model, I have to tell one of our pass rushers. The other day I’m like, Hey, every time you come out of your your first step and you stand straight up, you’re giving your chest to the offensive lineman. Don’t do that. Shoot straight out. Okay. And in those conversations like that, that’s how you take something from a technical model from mechanics and you blend it in. But getting now getting further into the conditioning size, I get closer and closer to the sport. Like now, it becomes very, very specific in my conditioning demands. As I get closer to the season, I should say my conditioning demand becomes my metabolic plays. I create metabolic tempos, um, and rest to work to rest ratio is that mimic the game clock, and I’ll actually start building their play count so they can tolerate practices.

[0:47:40 Speaker 3] So let me ask you this, coach, because I think this is, um, maybe something a lot of football coaches and strength coaches would ask is, Where does aerobic conditioning or longer distance conditioning? Let’s say anything above 50 yards. Where does that play in the game of football? What role does that play

[0:48:02 Speaker 0] to me? I think it goes back to where I’ll implement my tempo runs. I think that the sport itself is played in a domain of aerobic system, but it’s it’s all a lactic. It’s a lactic, and it bleeds into the lactate system. So to me, yeah, you’re found. They’re all happening at the same time. The sport itself is 2.5 hours long, so I’m in the aerobic zone. A lot of things I do are low intensity, but my heart rate doesn’t come all the way down, so I’m there. So I do think that might warm up. My warm up is 15 minutes of tempo work that I think is robust enough in that if you watch a lot of our walk through the same kind of thing. So these athletes are getting its specificity wise in the aerobic capacity. I I think there’s a time of year to work on the aerobic system, but again it goes back to what Coach Passed says. A lot of these athletes aren’t in the right shape when they go to play the sport. If they’ve lived there being fortunate enough to work with the M M A fighters who fight for a five minute round which, you know that is a high aerobic thought process. But it’s not aerobic, it’s it’s The intensities are so high that it’s anything but that It lives in the aerobic zone, but they’re living in a lactate capacity lactate power zone.

[0:49:19 Speaker 2] I had a quick question. Uh, coastline now, Coach path. You You’ve seen this. Both of you guys have seen this and you saw this when you were working on football. I’m sure talking about conditioning. But every fall camp,

[0:49:31 Speaker 0] when

[0:49:32 Speaker 2] I was working on football, we would have guys that would work out all summer and condition and kind of to speak to this point. Your first seven days of can’t you have, I mean, multiple hamstring pools. And, you know, I could see this. We were running the sub Max sprints, right? There was really not a lot of max speed that took place in summer conditioning, at least not when I saw it. And you see coaches, they do a lot of longer high volume, slower speed stuff. Then you go into camp that first, even if they’re in helmets, there’s still adrenaline’s up, and they’re I mean, they’re running max speed, usually about you see about day 567 man, you get started, just kind of right and get the pad out because they just started getting plucked off.

[0:50:17 Speaker 1] How do you How do you

[0:50:19 Speaker 2] try to mitigate some of that?

[0:50:22 Speaker 0] For me? It’s the It’s the metabolic that I talked about is making things that are more change of direction in nature and coming up with plays that are maybe generic in nature at times may be specific to position, but they have to have elements of change direction. The other thing that I’ll say is most athletes to is the density of work, the density of work. The coaches on the field are never paying attention to our work to rest ratio like we do. It’s like, All right, get up, hurry up, get up to the line, get up the line next time. So the density of work is so much higher or the load per minute, if you will, is so much higher in those practices than typically what you train at A lot of times, if you’re following good rest to, um, work to rest intervals like we tend to do in our field. Well, the problem is that we take things that we defined by science. And then we apply a sport to and say Okay, now you’ve got to fit this this square of what the demands are of the sport. And at the end of the day, those coaches don’t necessarily have an eye. They might know when the athletes starting to look sluggish or a little fatigued. But, you know, we gotta push through that. We’ve got to push. So for me, it’s the ability to have these athletes, um, go through these these reactive change of direction drills as their conditioning. I mean, that is a key component to it leading into those camps. If these guys are just going straight ahead, I mean, you’re you’re working in this one plane and we can sit there and argue that it’s it’s multi plane or even if we’re going satchel. But the ability to start stop and then turn myself, you know, 45 degrees, 1 80 then burst the other way. That’s a whole different contract. I’ll need

[0:51:55 Speaker 2] mhm coach path. What would you say?

[0:51:59 Speaker 1] Well, I’m probably gonna upset some people, but like if it guys are going to get put into unique task, so I I just watched a D Lineman returned a fumble 40 yards. He had to get up right and run. You know, I watched the lineman chase quarterbacks from sidelines sidelines. They had to get up and run. So a If athletes don’t know how to execute movements safely and smartly and efficiently at various phase of the running gait, then what makes us think that when they get in, that was positions, they know what to do. Second is you got to vaccinate people. It may be through micro dozing or maybe occurring in practice or whatever, but they have to micro dose. So like I work with a lot of running backs in the NFL and I tell them, Look, on certain days of the week, pick five or six plays and burst 40 50 yards. Get your micro dose of speed in because if we don’t vaccinate these guys and they don’t know what to do when they’re in these positions, we’re just asking for trouble.

[0:53:17 Speaker 2] That’s really good, Coach. Yeah, Mhm.

[0:53:21 Speaker 3] I’m going to ask one more specific question on conditioning because I like this topic as a soccer strength conditioning coach. Um, what role do you find conditioning, playing in power, sports. And how do you condition for a power sports? So one of the sports I work with is diving, and I do not want to diminish the amount of power that they’re able to generate. But I still condition them as athletes. So what is what are your immediate thoughts on conditioning for power sports?

[0:53:51 Speaker 1] Okay, I’m gonna upset some more people here, so we throw around terms like fitness and conditioning and robust, and I’m like, What’s robust? Okay, a diver walks four or five steps and explodes, and then a second later has a huge impact. That’s their ergonomic world. So they need to develop a capacity to do that over and over and over several times a day. Running miles through the woods is not developing those capacities. Running intervals on the track is not developing a diver’s capacity to do their task. If I’m a d a nose guard, I’m gonna smack the shit out of somebody and run about six steps. That’s what I need to develop. A capacity for running to hundreds in the off season is not developing the biochemistry or the pathways or the movement expression for those capacities. So I think conditioning is kind of a an ambiguous term, and it’s kind of like, What are we conditioning? So with all this GPS stuff and accelerometers and whatnot, I worked with European soccer teams and NFL, so I had a running back that a day where it was all goal line situation. It was an O. T. A camp. So the whole day was goal line plagues. So his GPS state, it didn’t look like he ran very far, very fast. But when we looked at his accelerometer yet like over 400 high speed change in direction movements, this guy was toast for two or three days. But if we looked at his data or we just stood back as a coach and say that I didn’t do shit today. Mhm. So I think we have to get a little deeper on this. What are we, conditioning question rather than just use this broad stroke? Sorry to rant, but

[0:56:01 Speaker 3] no, it’s good. Coach Landau, Did you have any thoughts on that?

[0:56:04 Speaker 0] You know, I think the one thing that I go back to as well as well I see a lot of our players that will want to do extra work. They want to do extra work. And one of the biggest things I always tell them is you only have so many athletic bullets in your lifetime. Use them sparingly. Trust when the hay’s in the barn. Trust when you know you. If you’ve had three days of practice and depending on how your team practices, you’re good, you’re good. You don’t have to do more. But in your given scenario, I would do things that are specific to the task. But again, I would watch you know that you don’t waste. I always say, Don’t shoot the Don’t don’t shoot the bullets up in the air. Don’t waste them So you know, And that’s easy to that. That’s harder for a maybe a 18 to 21 year old college age athletes think, but for me and my realm, that’s how I have to think now, because I know that the additional reps at the age of 22 can take away from what happens at 28 29. For some of these guys, the accumulation is real.

[0:57:05 Speaker 3] Absolutely no, I like that. Don’t shoot the bullets up in the air I’m gonna use that.

[0:57:11 Speaker 2] Well, Coach, I got a I got the next question here for these guys. Um, if both of you coaches were to look kind of look at the crystal ball and kind of go into the future sports performance, what do you see? Coming down in the future? Any innovations, advances technology back to the basics. What do you guys see? What kind of comes to your mind right away? You see, in the future shape,

[0:57:37 Speaker 0] coach, you want tackle that one first?

[0:57:39 Speaker 1] Sure. Well, I think with the virus with covid or as we knew it is done, I think it’s gonna reorganize and reshape. I don’t think it’ll go away. But organizations, federations, Olympic Committee’s universities, proteins. Everybody’s been looking for an off ramp from this arms race, So I I think it’s gonna change. I think we’re probably gonna seem more private and club influence and less school so on and so forth. That said, on the nuts and bolts of coaching, I think a I will become a higher player. I think wearable technology like plant a gig, insoles and whatnot. I think we’re going to develop better horizontal, uh, paradigms. Where we have integrated people communicating transparently, openly and honestly, where everybody at the table has input and influence. I think the debrief processes will get more layered and more specific. But I really think the top down in the silo era is slowly, uh, dying away, if you will. Hey,

[0:58:57 Speaker 2] coach, real quick. So you made me think of the There’s a book by, um, It’s right there. It’s called Team of Teams by Stanley McChrystal. He talks about that about you know, the bureaucracy and put the politics in these big organizations patients. It slows down. There’s, you know, lack of trust, community, very complex situations, but because it moves. So this was back during the war. We were moving so slow we were getting beat. And so one of the one of the the answers to that was flattening out the organization. Uh, everybody communicating at the table, Nobody being hired another Everybody working together, communicating, sharing information being transparent and it sped up. The process is in the war, so just that’s a good point like that,

[0:59:46 Speaker 0] you know? And I guess from my point, if I’m looking at the crystal ball with what I’m hopeful what the industry can do and where we’re going with our industry and the industry of coaching, I just to me Covid has taught us a number of things has taught us how important communication is in the realm of coaching. Uh, coaching with a mask on is very, very hard, because the one thing that you it’s very challenging to get across is emotion. And to me, I think emotion is such a key driver in, um in coaching and getting your athletes to buy in and getting them excited. And I’m hopeful that some of these soft skills become stronger when we get outside of this. You know, we we didn’t take it for granted. The ability to openly communicate, give fist bumps and and, you know, high fives, two guys after a PR or a great lift or a great workout. I’m hopeful that the social skills get stronger. I love the technology. I’m fortunate that I have the technology that we work with. I just hope that we get better at understanding the technology, and I think part of that is user, and I think part of that is is just getting better in the industry. I understand what it is we’re looking at and what kind of things can become actionable to me. It’s great to have all the technology that we have, but if it’s not an actionable item, it’s worthless. We’re basically just checking off the box and we’ve got this. We got this. We got this. Let’s hope nobody gets hurt. It’s got to be actionable and for action, for it to be actionable, you have to have the coaches and whoever you’re whoever oversees development, athletic training. They all have to again, like you guys said at the table and be able to discuss and have some of the hard conversations. But understand that those hard conversations are ultimately for a win win scenario. So that’s what I’m hopeful for in our in our in our field. Mhm,

[1:01:31 Speaker 2] mhm. So

[1:01:33 Speaker 3] I’m going to start to land the plane a little bit for us here. But, um, you both have been in the field for many years and I would say are at the top of our field. So what would you contribute your longevity and success in the field to And what advice would you give young coaches?

[1:01:55 Speaker 1] Well, for me as I said earlier, I was blessed to grow up being forced into a neo generalist, if you were so. I wore a lot of hats and realized real quick. I wasn’t ready to wear some hats. So I value network and curiosity and the scientific method. So I was really fortunate to evolve that way. I’ve had some tremendous mentors and peers like Lauren and I will. We’ll talk for hours on end on some mundane topic, and it just spurns further research or bigger dialogues or pulling guys into our network that we never even dream should be in our network. So for me, you know when young people say what what should I do? Like stay curious, build layers and layers of networks, don’t worship science, blindly, challenge it and develop the soft skills like a lot of our industry is management. So what? How much work are you doing in management and understanding, management and communications and relationships? You know, I have a son and daughter. I have two grandchildren, have a wife like how I handle things today versus five years ago or light years because I’m thrown into the coal face and I got to figure it out. So experience is critical, like get dirty and get dirty, A diverse at time. And my last closing statement is news failure as a springboard. It’s not a negative. Mhm. We’re truly honest. We all fail way more than we succeed. Mhm. Yeah,

[1:03:51 Speaker 0] absolutely. I couldn’t agree more. I’d say that. You know, if I’m talking to young coach, the number one thing I tell my young coaches at my facility or if they work for me at the Broncos, is you have to weather the storm in this industry. And, you know, whether you’re in the private sector and the collegiate sector, the professional sector, you’ve got to be able to weather the storm. In a lot of cases were low hanging fruit on fruit on a lot of topics. Um, and so you have to be good at understanding your sciences and understanding how to back engineer and have those communication points when you are low hanging fruit. On a certain topic, all the teams not fast enough. So we’ve sustained injuries. How do you sit there and back, engineer the work that’s been done and how you show that those things aren’t quite true? and here’s the variables that led to X y Z. You have to be. You have to have deep rooted experience. You have to have the failures, Coach said. Uh, and you have to have a strong network around you to help solve some of those problems that you’re going to run into. I’d say early on in my career, for sure, I wasn’t equipped to handle some of the conversations that I found myself getting into. But you then research people. You, you you add to your network and you learn more of some of those things that lead to whether it’s an injury and insult that happened and you communicate through those things. And then now you have an experience. Uh oh, I’ve seen this before and here’s how I dealt with it in the past. Everything is about your experience, what you retain, what you learned too many times. When coaches are young, they never want to be at fault. They never want to say they made a mistake, and, as coach said, as the wrong thing to do, you have to own your mistakes. You have to learn from your mistakes to ultimately not repeat them. again. In our industry, we are low hanging fruit, and we’ve got to be prepared to to defend our case. Mm. Yeah.

[1:05:39 Speaker 2] And I’ve got one last question, and we’ll wrap this up today. Fun question. Here. Hopefully, um, both of you guys definitely. You know, successful have very demanding jobs. What do you do if anything, Any hobbies? What do you do to relax, coach path you can share first and then coach, what do you guys do?

[1:05:59 Speaker 1] Well, I’m a voracious readers, especially with covid. That’s my favorite activity. Um, I jog every day. Have since I was 20 years old. So that’s how I explored and unwind and meditate. It’s 30 to 50 minutes without a phone or emails or whatever. Practice. Different breathing rhythms. I do keep going in the morning. Try to get centered and get this body moving to the coffee machine.

[1:06:31 Speaker 2] I

[1:06:32 Speaker 1] love to fish. You know, I like fly fishing.

[1:06:36 Speaker 2] That’s right. I forgot. You like to fish? Yeah, that’s good.

[1:06:38 Speaker 1] A little harder at age 66 with surgeries and what not you got to be a little more careful where you fish now.

[1:06:46 Speaker 2] And

[1:06:48 Speaker 1] big hobby mind right now is two grandkids. They keep me young. Yes,

[1:06:53 Speaker 2] sir. Take it, Coach. What about you coastland down?

[1:06:57 Speaker 0] You know, I I’d say the way I am, Wind, I say I don’t necessarily unwind, But being really regimented to a structured schedule is key for me. Um, you know, working out daily. I’m a big fan like my big escape is music. I love music and I love all types of music, so that’s a big escape for me reading, believe it or not, I mean, it’s still involved in the field, but getting on the phone, sending messages to coach path or other coaches as well. And just having that conversation that just that that continues to inspire you, uh, in the field when the day to day gets pretty challenging. You have those inspiration type conversations with those peers and those mentors around you. So those are probably the best things. And ultimately my family, my wife and my kids like, there’s no way we could do our roles that we do without an incredible support staff. And, you know, they they they take on more than their fair share of, uh, you know, the long hours that we put in. So they’re probably a big, big recharge for me when I get home.

[1:08:03 Speaker 2] Thank you, coaches.

[1:08:06 Speaker 3] Well, thank you guys. So much for being a part of our roundtable today. Um, I mean, we’re incredibly appreciative of your time. We know that it’s precious, and we appreciate that you are friends of the staff, and we’ve been fortunate to have you both speak to us a couple of times. But for our clinic attendees that are watching this or anybody seen this, how would someone go about getting in contact with you or learning more about some of the content that you guys have put out?

[1:08:35 Speaker 1] Well, one of my consultancy without this. It’s a training group Training center, coaches to education therapist, education type center. And if you go to the Web and click on that, there’s just tons of free information and projects and experiences there. So that’s the quickest, simplest way.

[1:08:56 Speaker 3] Awesome. Thank you.

[1:08:58 Speaker 0] And for me, just any social media platform that is my name Loren Landau. And then, uh, you know, you can reach me directly at lm landau at gmail dot com. Any questions or anything like that?

[1:09:10 Speaker 3] Thank you, guys.

[1:09:12 Speaker 2] Thank you. All right, so we’ll close it out. Coach Craig, thank you. For, uh, being on today, you’re our clinic director. And I’ll tell you what, uh, I think everybody’s gonna be more than, uh, meet their expectations. I know we couldn’t have our normal clinic, but you coach path. Thank you so much, Coach Lando. Thank you so much. I know both of, you know, coach Path. Just again. The investment you put in me years ago, I still coach. I still use, uh, some of your your sayings, uh, from different things. I know. I said something. Somebody they’re getting they were getting worked on. I said, make them blow a snot bubble that the coach path saying right there, you know? So I know you’ve had a lot of influence over a lot of people, so coaches just know nothing but respect and love an aberration for you, Coach Back and Coach Landel. Same for you. You just You’re definitely you’re the elite in our field. A lot of people are following your lead and looking up to you as well. So we appreciate you guys making time in your busy schedule. So, uh, Coach Craig, you want to say anything about Maybe possibly not this year, but next year Clinic?

[1:10:18 Speaker 3] Yeah, we’re hoping to be back in 2022 January. So if everything goes according to plan, we’ll be seeing our attendees in person. So thank you, guys.

[1:10:28 Speaker 2] Thanks so much for tuning in and listening to this episode of the team behind the team podcast for future episodes. Go to iTunes, Spotify, Google podcast or stitcher. We definitely want to keep having great guests on the show in great content. So if you have a moment, please go to iTunes, leave a rating and review and let us know how we’re doing. I’m Donny made. And thanks so much for tuning in. Yeah, yeah. Mm