Episode 06: Charles Camarillo – Poteet ISD Superintendent

[00:00:00] Andrew: Schooling is one of the few experiences majority of Americans share. Yet how much do we really know what goes on behind the scene? And what’s up with cafeteria lunches? I team up with developmental psychologist David Yeager to explore the personal side of education by speaking with superintendents.

I’m Andrew Kim, and I consider myself an accidental superintendent for the past 15 years. So grab your lunch money, and And welcome to Lunch Duty.

I’m glad to be here in Poteet Independent School District. I appreciate you having me here today. Thank you. for having me. Now, Charles, Dr. Camarillo, tell me about, oh, Mr. Camarillo. Well, tell me about how long you’ve been in the, Poteet Independent School District. Six years. Six years. Now let me ask you this.

now you are from here. Yes. Graduated from here. 1987. 1987. I didn’t ask you that. so you graduated famous. So how was it when you were growing up here? It was great. Was it great?

[00:01:05] Charles: Oh, we had a good time. Did you?

[00:01:06] Andrew: Oh yeah. What’s your fondest memories about the school district back in the day?

[00:01:10] Charles: just, the extracurricular activity that my friend and I got to do, not only in school, but out of school.

[00:01:16] Andrew: Now you probably did everything

[00:01:17] Charles: though, right? We, we had, we had no shortage of having a good time. So, but yeah,

[00:01:21] Andrew: but you were in what baseball, football, you were

[00:01:23] Charles: doing everything and then close to that group who met today that I went to school with 12 years in a row, you know, so you become pretty tight

[00:01:33] Andrew: to the listeners out there.

We went to lunch at La Mesa, La Mesa, La Mesa. And there was first of all, great chicken fried steak special, but everybody knew you. Yes. And, they all came to you and talked to you about, the good old days and the current days and a lot of people in this town come back to this town or stay here.

[00:01:55] Charles: I think some come back.

I think some never leave. Is that right? Probably the majority who stuck around or didn’t venture far and then came back. I was gone 30 years, so I’m one of those that did come back, but it didn’t happen immediately.

[00:02:09] Andrew: Now, Poteet is, for those listeners who might not know, it’s in the south of San Antonio.

Correct. About half an hour. Half an hour away. beautiful countryside. Yes. It’s about to grow. Yes. But you left? I left. And you left for college obviously. I went to school in

[00:02:24] Charles: St. Mary’s in San Antonio. Okay. I didn’t go very far, but I did leave and then from there I went and I worked at A& M for three and a half years.

[00:02:31] Andrew: And was it something about your upbringing here, I mean did you like love the principal, the superintendent so much that you went into education? No,

[00:02:39] Charles: you know, I think I got into education by accident. What do you mean by accident? I was a biology major and when I left St. Mary’s I was in A& M’s medical school you.

Working, oh, in the lab, you know, doing research with a, with a, with a PhD there, thinking about maybe going down the same route. Is that right? Not sure exactly what I was gonna do in my life. And then I followed a woman to Temple with the intent of, of doing similar work that I had been doing at the a and m College of Medicine.

Yeah. So they have their second half over there. And affiliation with Scott and White. And while I was looking for work, I started substitute teaching. You did? Yes. High school or middle school? Everywhere. Everywhere they would call me, I would go. I was one of the few that wasn’t particularly picky. And one of the few places that I would go that many would not was the alternative school.

Oh, wow. For a discipline, a D. A. E. P. Yeah. And so, I minded my own business one day, working at the D. A. E. P. And a teacher quit. Right then and there. Wow. At midterm. And they offered me the job. Is that right? So, I didn’t have a teaching certificate, so I went to Mary Hart and Baylor, met with an advisor and set out a 15 hour that I needed to, to do, and, was hired on to teach at, in, in that alternative school.

So, By having gone back to UMHB, I felt I had some momentum, so I entered the master’s program.

[00:04:02] Andrew: Now, what went through your mind about teaching in Austin? First of all, at a DAEP, and for those listeners, it’s a disciplinary alternative

[00:04:11] Charles: education program. I did well in that school. Whenever I would sub, I’d be, I subbed there often enough that I became familiar with the clientele and then with me.

And I found that I had a knack on being able to deal with kids, trouble kids.

[00:04:23] Andrew: And so you felt that, did somebody encourage you to, Hey, you need to go into administration or did you

[00:04:28] Charles: just, I knew that I don’t want to teach forever. I knew I wanted to make a living. And so, like I said, I went back to school.

I had to take 15 hours, I think, for qualified to take my, my teaching certificate, so I applied for the master program and. Cut in back when it was every day, every night, four days, four nights a week, like now where you can do everything online, you’ve had physically go there really four nights a week. So teaching, I got my master’s in 2000, December of 2000, passed my test in February, taught, had intent to teach one more year, minding my own business in third week of August when I got a, I’m at a Lowe’s.

Hardware. Yeah. You get a phone call. High school secretary. High school principal. Mr. Callahan would like to see if you have time tomorrow to come see him. Sure. Mr. Callahan decided to shuffle the APs. Yep. Grade level split and put the senior AP as the new freshman AP and she quit. Oh, wow. With a week to go before school started.

Oh, wow. So he and I met, on a Thursday morning, on a Friday morning, and, he offered me the job that afternoon and I landed at Temple High on a Monday. As an assistant principal. Brand spanking new with 30 teachers, two dyads, a counselor, a nurse. And 800 freshmen.

[00:05:48] Andrew: Now you took the job, obviously, but did you feel at that moment, you were adequately prepared to do the job?

No,

[00:05:54] Charles: no, but I figured, Hey, why not me? Right. Why not you? That’s right. Either think of flam. And so did that for four years

[00:06:02] Andrew: now, before you go any further though, Mr. Callahan. How did he know to call you? I subbed a lot

[00:06:08] Charles: at the high school. So secretary knew me. Oh. And through my conversation with her, she knew I was in school.

Is that right? To get my master’s.

[00:06:17] Andrew: So she, put your

[00:06:18] Charles: name in there a little bit. He found himself in a bind with school to go without an AP. Gave me a call. Wow. Great opportunity. Learned a lot from him. Did you? Yeah.

[00:06:26] Andrew: Now, how long were you a assistant principal there at Temple? And then you had another strange,opportunity.

I’ve

[00:06:33] Charles: been at AP for four years. There had been some administration changes. Mr. Kelly had been moved to the junior high when the new superintendent came in, a political move. I saw the writing on the wall. And I thought, I thought I’d been there long enough as an AP that I thought maybe it’s time for me to try to get my own school.

Yeah. As a principal. As a principal. And then I have to be in Temple. But, so I threw out feelers. I interviewed in Navasota. I interviewed in, Cameron, and then I interviewed in Somerville for their high school principal and went through a series of two interviews, one with the committee, one with the board.

And then,following Friday after my last interview was called and offered to superintendent

[00:07:10] Andrew: and you told me a great story about that. You weren’t the first pick on that choice. No, the Poteet

[00:07:18] Charles: wasn’t. That’s right. So I went to Somerville without a certificate. so I went to A& M and took 15 hours.

To be the superintendent to get my, so I can qualify to take my tests. I did that and tested February, March of my second year in Somerville, passed it

[00:07:34] Andrew: now just to, just to unravel here a little bit. cause that was my bad about the confusion, but you went to Somerville for a principal job opportunity, but the board.

They did the interviewing the last interview. Yes. Yeah. But they decided to hire you as a superintendent, correct? So you went from an assistant principal to superintendency. Correct. Right off the bat. I skipped. You skipped the principalship. Yes. Now, were you prepared for that? No. So,

[00:08:01] Charles: so you took the job. So I tell people that,a unique combination of ignorance and arrogance.

Ignorance. I didn’t know anything and I know any better. Right. I just did. Yeah. And arrogant because now I’m a 35 year old superintendent. I think I’m the best thing since sliced bread. So then I have to at least. Pretend that I knew what I was doing. And, and I, you know, when you work at a 5A school and I had a lot of duties, including the budget.

You do get quite a bit of experience. And, and, and a good mentor. It becomes the same thing to a degree when you’re dealing with people. Yeah. Being a problem solver, conflict resolution. Yeah. being mindful, thoughtful of the decisions you make and, and relationships. you know, I was told once that they like you.

They’ll forgive you. They will. They don’t like you. They will not. Yeah. Before everything becomes

[00:08:49] Andrew: fatal. And sometimes, eventually they don’t like you sometimes. Eventually they don’t

[00:08:52] Charles: like you. It’s a tough job. I was there 13 years. We had some really good years and we had some challenging years. you know, the smaller the school, the harder it is to, to progress sometimes.

You know, not only extracurricularly, because you’re constantly always starting over, but academically, every kid matters. Every kid counts. Accountability becomes

[00:09:10] Andrew: tricky. Is it because of the resources, you think, or is it something else?

[00:09:14] Charles: poverty, economics, I think economics drives everything. So when you’re low socioeconomic school, whether you’re black, white, brown, green, or yellow, or multicolored, that doesn’t matter.

I think when you’re, you’ve got a large population or kids who are at risk and eco disc, then you already started, you know, at a disadvantage. Well, you,

[00:09:33] Andrew: when you took that job in Somerville, I could imagine, I remember when I was an assistant principal, I didn’t know any better about anything. even being an assistant principal, by the way, were you scared or were you worried or

[00:09:44] Charles: Sure.

You know, if there’s going to be a one and done, you always worry that you don’t want to blow it because you know, you, you feel that if you don’t make, if you don’t do well enough or stay long enough to at least establish some credibility, you may not get another shot.

[00:10:00] Andrew: What did you, what did you, if you can recall, what did you not know about that you were shocked about when you took that job from a.

Assistant principal to a superintendency,

[00:10:11] Charles: probably the board side of it dealing with seven different personalities who all say they don’t have an agenda, but they all do. I don’t care what anybody tells you. Because the rest was very similar. You’re dealing with teachers at the teacher level. You’re dealing with administrator at the administrator level and kid to kids.

And like I said, the district was smaller than the high school I came from. Right. So it wasn’t a lot of difference in the day to day, other than learning some of the new skills and understanding my role, but dealing more with the community than I had to before. Sure. In a bigger district, you deal with your school and the people within your school and the parents you deal with on a regular basis from your frequent flyers.

But you’re not really. Accessible or known to the community. Yep. And in Somerville, everybody knows you. Quickly. Yeah. You saw it today in Poteet. Poteet’s three times as big and, I gotta, I gotta mind myself what I’m doing and where I’m, what I’m doing and where I’m doing it, you know. Yep. cause I’m gonna run across people all the time.

Although. That are fully aware of who I am and what I do. That’s right.

[00:11:11] Andrew: Although we did have a,a young lady that thought that you were recruiting for, University of Maryland Baylor

[00:11:15] Charles: today. Yeah, we have a college day and what it amounts to, teachers want to wear jeans. Yep. What it amounts to is if you wear a college shirt on Wednesdays, you

[00:11:24] Andrew: can wear jeans.

Jeans days was a very popular day. Yeah, so we got

[00:11:27] Charles: three jeans days. Wednesday is college day, Thursday is campus shirt day, and Friday is Aggie Maroon Day. So you can literally wear jeans two days a week if you’re wearing the right

[00:11:40] Andrew: shirt. When you were at Somerville, who did you rely on? Did you rely on others nearby?

Did you rely on anybody or did you have a mentor that you just really trusted and relied on?

[00:11:51] Charles: Yes, and I’m going to kick myself for it. He was a mentor of mine. He worked out of Region 6. Okay, that’s a service center. Yes, he was a former superintendent and had been in Huntsville, Normandy. We’re just

[00:12:04] Andrew: talking about normal GIS But you remember this this gentleman was your mentor.

This was a guy the fuel service

[00:12:09] Charles: agent who would come in Yeah, a couple times a month. We closed the door and for about an hour hour and a half. It’s therapy session It was a therapy session. I could tell him things and and second guess myself and ask questions without Exposing myself at times. I don’t know what the hell I was doing.

[00:12:28] Andrew: Was it because you’re exposing You Sort of the imposter in this about what you’re

[00:12:33] Charles: doing, exposing a lot of method, be vulnerable to second guess myself to get, get confirmation that the, the, the, the direction I was going with. Okay. But there’s some of the decisions I had made where, you know, we’re, we’re, we’re okay.

but it was a safe environment. Yep. you trusted that I trusted him. Confidential. And, he’d, he’d, he’d done the work. Yeah. He’d been a small district and assumed small district politics. I don’t think not people understand. Very supportive. And so I leaned on him quite a bit. You did. And he passed on now, but he was, he was super important in probably the first two, three years.

I said, I kind of figured out what I

[00:13:09] Andrew: was doing. You know, I don’t think people understand truly the, the emotional, the mental side of being in this job as a superintendent in many ways, you

[00:13:17] Charles: don’t realize they’ve been there. When I left Somerville, I kind of promoted my curriculum person to, to take over.

I thought she deserved an opportunity at Somerville and Somerville. And so we’re sitting at region six one day and, and, you know, kind of the last rack of the, of my, of my tenure there in, Dr. Steve Johnson, you know, Dr. Steve. Yeah. Yeah. Another name. Yeah. He was a college station and at Huntsville. Anyway, he was the service center then retired.

He says you, he tells her. With me standing, so you have no idea what he does until you get in there and within a couple of years, you may, you may understand. Yeah, that’s all. You know what? I’ve never looked at it that way because I know what I do and I know what I’m doing. I know what I’m thinking. I just don’t.

Share. Yeah, but I’m doing what I’m thinking.

[00:14:07] Andrew: Very often. Why do you think that superintendents have a hard time? Or you that sharing issue? You know, is it because you’re not trying to put all the cards down? You haven’t yet worked it out. I mean, what’s your thoughts on

[00:14:19] Charles: that? Both? So, yeah, I think work things out.

You don’t want to expose, you know, be vulnerable. You don’t want people to ever think you’re unsure.

[00:14:28] Andrew: And, you know, I want to say the. I think he will say this and or just tell me that vulnerability is not about you being a vulnerable as a person. It’s about the vulnerableness of maybe the issues. I mean, what’s your thoughts on that

[00:14:39] Charles: one?

Just that the leader, you know, I believe wholeheartedly that when I walk in the room, things should get better. When there’s a problem that can’t be solved, I should be able to solve it. Yeah. Then when there’s conflict, I should be able to take care of it or I should make, you know, just get everything back to par.

Yeah. You want the people that work with you and for you to always assume that’s always going to happen or can happen or should

[00:15:01] Andrew: happen. Now, Charles, that’s a, that’s a heavy burden. It is a heavy burden. How do

that

[00:15:06] Charles: burden? I don’t know. I, I just, I’ve done it for a long time. You have, I’ve, I’ve, I’ve gotten good about not, not internalizing too, too deep.

Yeah. I care, but I don’t want it to eat me alive. And then I’ve learned a long time ago. I learned this in temple to leave it in the parking lot to the best of my ability. It’ll be here tomorrow when I get

[00:15:25] Andrew: here. Well, and that was a question I was going to ask, you know, how, how did you learn to do that?

You know, I just never, I carried it

[00:15:32] Charles: with me a lot. Yeah. I didn’t want to punish my family. Yeah, and I didn’t want to lose sleep for it. I like to sleep so

[00:15:40] Andrew: you slept. Well, I sleep

[00:15:42] Charles: well, I still do

[00:15:45] Andrew: I did not I did not sleep well

[00:15:47] Charles: and and it it’s it’s a five minutes compartment of life to such that I can leave it Now I do get nervous the first day of school.

I don’t, I don’t, I don’t have stage fright, but I do, I want to do well, right? You don’t want to look like an ass up there. But, but I like my sleep and, and, and, and, and my family time, my whole time are important. So I’ve managed through time, over time, not immediately. be able to separate.

[00:16:14] Andrew: Is there any nuance or advice that you give to a brand new superintendent about how you do that better?

Maybe a hobby or something? Or do you, I used to have a, a little prayer on a coaster on my desk and at the board dais. And I used to anchor that, and I would try to repeat that over and over again. In fact, it was Psalm 91 that I would actually read over and over and over again. It kind of triggered me into sort of grounding myself a little

[00:16:45] Charles: bit.

I don’t have a trick. I just don’t. I just, you know, try to understand what I can control and what I can’t control. And if I could have solved it here before I left, and I would have, but if I didn’t, then we’ll solve it tomorrow. Not that I don’t think about it, but I don’t let it consume me. Yeah. Or lose sleep for it.

Yeah. Or, or, or distract me from, from my home life.

[00:17:10] Andrew: Do you think that’s the hardest part of being a superintendent is to trying to emotionally, mentally deal with issues at the same time, deliver success

[00:17:20] Charles: out there? Yeah. And to be all things to all people. I think that’s an expectation from

[00:17:23] Andrew: without. Is that something that, is that possibly something anybody could succeed or, I mean, that’s, that’s a tall

task.

[00:17:31] Charles: No, it takes, I think it takes, it takes a certain kind of individual, somebody who’s got some patience, inner strength, backbone. Talk about the backbone a little bit. What do you mean by that? You have to stand your ground with the decisions you make. For the people who are carrying out the decision and for your bosses, I have to stand my ground above the world.

I have to constantly remind them that they’re not going to micromanage me. They’re not going to bully me. They’re not going to push me around. If they want to do that, there’s a process to move on. Until then, they need to stay in their lane. Cause their lane is very well defined. They just don’t always understand

[00:18:06] Andrew: it.

Mentally, then you’re prepared to basically say, Hey, I’m out of here. Or I’m prepared to fight. I’m prepared to fight

[00:18:13] Charles: and I’m prepared to go. I will fight rather than fold. So then, then, then what am I, I’m, I’m, I will not be a puppet for no one.

[00:18:23] Andrew: Yeah. Because, it’s, it’s hard to run the district. If you have seven different opinions,

[00:18:28] Charles: the moment I actually asked to one, for whatever reason, it’d be the same, it’d be a composite thing next time.

Yeah. And now it looked like a damn idiot because I’m inconsistent and, it just, I can’t, then I won’t sleep. So I’d rather fight. I can sleep if I fight. I can’t sleep if I fall.

[00:18:47] Andrew: So that’s the non negotiable for you, right? It is.

[00:18:51] Charles: It’s more sold now than ever because I can retire. I

[00:18:54] Andrew: have leverage. So you have educational peace.

Absolutely. About it. Yes. Are you, are you bolder as a

[00:19:01] Charles: result of that, you think? Yes. Yes. You are. I think they need me more than I need them.

[00:19:05] Andrew: so what are you, what’s bold? I mean, what were you doing? That’s bold. I mean, what, what’s

[00:19:09] Charles: not get as excited, not get, not get overly upset over things, not just kind of take it what’s going on and fix it or get it fixed without expending too much emotional capital on it.

Yeah. Yeah. Worth it. There are very few things that can’t be resolved. That’s right. Unless I commit a crime and steal, steal money or touch a kid, you know, those things that land people on the front page. Beyond that, where if you, I get folks come in here, they’re all fired up about something that just happened.

And I’m thinking it’s not a good thing, but it’s not the end of the world, you know, you are

[00:19:50] Andrew: going to be all right, you’re part counselor, therapist, you know, maybe even a spiritual guy, perhaps, all sorts of things to people, when you play all those roles, do you confuse yourself about yourself by the way?

Cause,

[00:20:03] Charles: I don’t think so.

[00:20:04] Andrew: You know who you are and make that work. And that’s pretty strong statement, by the way. I mean, I’m impressed. we gotta get back to this story about how you became the superintendent

[00:20:14] Charles: Poteet. So it was a weird search. It was, no, there was no search. Firm. Firm. The board did it, but they didn’t advertise anywhere but the Pote site.

The only reason I knew, ’cause a board member told my mother. Because you were from this town? Yeah. So my mother said they think pot’s gonna come open the current soup and then hot water. They’re giving him a hard time. They’re trying to push him out. The board had switched, changed enough for. Four and a four had come on, three, two came on, then one, then one, and when they finally got four, they started rattling his chains.

So my mother said, hey, I think Poteet’s gonna come open soon. So sure enough, about mid fall of 17, it’s posted. And the Poteet talent ed, not on TASA,

[00:21:08] Andrew: not anything in the state statewide,

[00:21:10] Charles: just locally. Yeah. And that you’re looking for, you’re not going to find it.

[00:21:13] Andrew: What do they mean to find somebody local

[00:21:14] Charles: then?

I think they were thinking they had a, they had a, a person here, a TA monitor for the finance. They were broke. They had lost an investigation because they were mixing money, bond money, construction money, all that kind of business. They had a monitor in here. The assistant soup was interim. The monitor and the assistant soup became buddies.

So she convinced the board that they didn’t have enough money. They couldn’t afford to lock a search firm. They couldn’t afford to do an extensive search. She recommended that she’s already the interim that they make her superintendent, but the board didn’t like her. Wow. Right. So they advertise it and they get four applicants.

Yep. The current interim assistant, former curriculum director, now region 20. Wow. A high school principal from another district. And me, that’s pretty small. I’ve had more applicants for food service on any given day for a custodial position. So,

[00:22:17] Andrew: typically boards, claim to have 50 applicants for a job.

Yeah.

[00:22:21] Charles: I’ve had a hundred applicants for an AD job in service. Yeah. You know, that’s a two eighths job. So we do interviews, come in for an interview with the board, spend an hour or so, say goodbye. I don’t hear nothing from Poteet. No, no, no. Thank you. Not sorry. Great job. Just completely unprofessional.

Right. Yeah. I hear of course, through the great right through my mother, but they’ve offered it to the former, Curriculum Director who’s not in Region 20. I see. They just gotta wait 21 days. Wow. So that’s all she wrote, right? So, The Monday of the Tuesday before 21 days shows up, so they can hire her.

My understanding is she gets to win, that the board’s gonna go 6 1. Mm. To her higher and she wants all seven mm She

[00:23:07] Andrew: bulls. She backs up because typically some superintendents take a five, two, yeah. Six, one. Yeah. Even a four, three even. I know some guys see what happens. Yeah. So she

[00:23:17] Charles: pulls that in and I’m coaching did league for my oldest boy call, no for this one for my youngest boy in Texas.

[00:23:26] Andrew: You’re coaching third base first base

[00:23:29] Charles: phone ring that walked to the outfield and it’s a board president, offering me the job. That’s it. That’s the only call I got from

[00:23:36] Andrew: Poteet. And then you took it on the spot. Yes. Now, why’d you take it? Because I want to come home. You have to come home. Yes. So coming home was the

[00:23:45] Charles: important thing.

Yes. Most super city superintendent would not have taken this job. Yeah. Just to take it right without something, something bigger because it was broke. Yeah. I had a monitor. It was dysfunctional. Yep. Had a bunch of snakes working here.

[00:24:00] Andrew: Well, if you describe that at any place that was not your home, you probably wouldn’t have taken it.

Why would you?

[00:24:04] Charles: Right. Why would you inherit, what would you take on at that point in my career? Because I was okay with that. Yeah, you’re doing well. I could have stayed. Yeah,

[00:24:13] Andrew: finished out. So you decided to take this job because of the home, the home

[00:24:17] Charles: factor. Come to be closer to my parents. You know, we do visit once three, four or five times a year Yeah, as they were getting older and The visits were lasting shorter and getting harder to leave and just missing being around them.

Yeah. And I knew my kids had missed quite a bit of being around their grandparents because of proximity. So it was my intent to come this way no matter what. They didn’t have to be protein. They didn’t have to be superintendent. I was willing to take on that. You know, is that right? Having a job or assistant job, but you want to come home

[00:24:48] Andrew: while you got your wish.

And now six years into it, you’re doing extremely well six years later. And that small little fund balance or whatever they had at that time that you’re up to 14 million in fund balance. And that’s quite a bit for a size of this school district. In my

[00:25:02] Charles: opinion, my CFO is extraordinary. So we’ve done a good job and, and, and caught up when I say caught up curriculum wise, Infrastructure wise, culture wise, culture wise, transportation, technology, security, and made a lot of progress

[00:25:19] Andrew: and you’re a hometown hero as a result of that, and certainly, done well for yourself.

And I got to tell you, I really appreciate it. You make it the time for me. We can conclude on that. No, on that high note, because this is lunch duty after all. And we got to talk about a best lunch duty story you have in your career so far that you can remember you and I were talking about your assistant principal back, days in temple high school.

but is there any other lunch duty stories you had that, you know, cause any good administrator, you know, we’ve all done lunch duty. I mean, every educator

[00:25:53] Charles: has, we, You know, we had an expectation. There were three lunches at temple and you could go to four or five different options, the hot line, the salad line, the pizza line, the sandwich line, the taco line, anyway, A, B, and C.

And each one was like this. A lot of kids, by the way, but you found you, you notice that kids will sit in the same place at the same table every day. Right. No matter how many are in there, right. Creatures of habit. So the rule was you clean your mess. When you get up from your table, you take your trash with you, or otherwise.

We never said or otherwise, just that it was a rule. So, one day, last lunch of the day, lunch C, about 10 girls got up from their table and left their trash. Oh no. So next day, I made placards that said reserved, and put four of them to cover the length of the table that they sat at. So here they come, same 10, going to the same table and turning that corner, and see reserved on their table.

All tables around them are full, except theirs. Nobody’s sitting there. It’s reserved. And now they can’t sit there. And they froze in place. And were completely, utterly lost. That is a bet. As to what to do next. Not find somewhere else. Yeah. Not ask what’s going on. Just realize that their routine had been completely interrupted.

And now they were completely at a loss of what to do next. That’s a bet. Unless I intervene, they might still be standing there with their train in their hands. Oh my

[00:27:23] Andrew: gosh. That would have been a

[00:27:26] Charles: awesome sight to see. So there was a learning opportunity. I said, this is because you left your trash. And if you leave your trash, I want to take your table.

Man. Never have that

[00:27:34] Andrew: problem again. That is a great, that’s a great strategy. I didn’t even think about that. That is all because you’re right. Kids sit in the same seats. Every day. Every day. Same seat, same

[00:27:42] Charles: group. Same group, same friends. And maybe eat the same thing. Yep.

[00:27:46] Andrew: Pretty much. Chicken

[00:27:47] Charles: tender, chicken fingers.

Some burgers or something, yeah. But

[00:27:49] Andrew: you put a reserve sign and told them you can’t sit there anyway, and then you go anywhere else, huh?

[00:27:54] Charles: Yeah, or they or you could maybe just toss it out to the side. No, they didn’t. It said reserve, therefore you can’t sit here. Wow. And therefore they had nowhere else to sit.

There were other tables available. Sure. But for them, there was no other option but that table and it blew their mind. That’s

[00:28:09] Andrew: gonna, you know, whoever’s listening to this better write that activity down and try to like talk about it. That is a pretty good one. I gotta tell you, it was,

[00:28:17] Charles: it was, it was, I didn’t know what to expect, but to see them come around the corner and freeze in place, and now you’d be able to verbalize what to do next was

[00:28:26] Andrew: priceless.

That’s awesome. That might be one of the best lunch duty stories I’ve ever heard so

[00:28:32] Charles: far. They got their table back and never left the, or a napkin or a piece of trash under my table again.

[00:28:40] Andrew: Bobby is a superintendent that I better tell him that story. I’ll make sure that he’s maybe doing something like that.

What

[00:28:45] Charles: I learned is a subtle thing. Sometime make the biggest difference coming in, hollering and screaming that you didn’t pick up your trash and making an ordeal out of it. He might have me or me have me blow me off and nothing got accomplished.

[00:28:58] Andrew: I’ll tell you what, you are doing some fantastic things.

You have a approach that I think, works not just because you’re a hometown guy here. But you can tell by walking around, spend some time with you and really meeting half the town that came to our table to talk with you. That tells you a lot. It tells you a lot. So I really appreciate you making the time for me.

Likewise. And I’ll let you know when this thing gets posted and you listen to it and laugh about it. Sure. All right. Well, I appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. Our first podcast. Lunch Duty is produced by David Yeager and me, Andrew Kim. We thank the Lates Development Studio and the Texas Behavioral Science and Policy Institute at the University of Texas at Austin for their support.

Thank you for listening and please join us for our next episode of Lunch Duty.