Adraint Bereal (Artist\/Texas Ex) talks to Brandon about graduating from UT during the unique Spring 2020 semester.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"
Adraint Bereal (Artist\/Texas Ex) talks to Brandon about graduating from UT during the unique Spring 2020 semester.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":13,"featured_media":0,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_genesis_hide_title":false,"_genesis_hide_breadcrumbs":false,"_genesis_hide_singular_image":false,"_genesis_hide_footer_widgets":false,"_genesis_custom_body_class":"","_genesis_custom_post_class":"","_genesis_layout":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"http:\/\/podcasts.la.utexas.edu\/live\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/24\/2020\/07\/LIVE-Ep5-Final-1.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"","filesize":"67.37M","filesize_raw":"70643725","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":"","itunes_episode_number":"","itunes_title":"","itunes_season_number":"","itunes_episode_type":""},"tags":[35,33,32,30,34,29,31],"series":[2],"class_list":{"0":"post-43","1":"podcast","2":"type-podcast","3":"status-publish","5":"tag-career","6":"tag-design","7":"tag-exes","8":"tag-graduation","9":"tag-graphic-design","10":"tag-rules","11":"tag-texas","12":"series-live","13":"entry"},"acf":{"related_episodes":"","hosts":[{"ID":68,"post_author":"39","post_date":"2020-07-20 20:29:28","post_date_gmt":"2020-07-20 20:29:28","post_content":"","post_title":"Dr. Brandon Jones","post_excerpt":"","post_status":"publish","comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","post_password":"","post_name":"dr-brandon-jones","to_ping":"","pinged":"","post_modified":"2020-07-20 20:33:17","post_modified_gmt":"2020-07-20 20:33:17","post_content_filtered":"","post_parent":0,"guid":"http:\/\/podcasts.la.utexas.edu\/live\/?post_type=speaker&p=68","menu_order":0,"post_type":"speaker","post_mime_type":"","comment_count":"0","filter":"raw"}],"guests":[{"ID":56,"post_author":"19","post_date":"2020-07-10 16:51:02","post_date_gmt":"2020-07-10 16:51:02","post_content":"\n
Adraint Bereal is a design major and has been involved in The Tejas Club and Student Government. He co-founded Onyx, the first black honor society on campus, and created The Black Yearbook to highlight the experiences of black students across campus. This project includes 200 unique images and 100 interviews from a variety of students. He has also been involved with many projects that support minority communities.<\/p>\n","post_title":"Adraint Bereal","post_excerpt":"","post_status":"publish","comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","post_password":"","post_name":"adraint-bereal","to_ping":"","pinged":"","post_modified":"2020-11-12 19:16:56","post_modified_gmt":"2020-11-12 19:16:56","post_content_filtered":"","post_parent":0,"guid":"http:\/\/podcasts.la.utexas.edu\/live\/?post_type=speaker&p=56","menu_order":0,"post_type":"speaker","post_mime_type":"","comment_count":"0","filter":"raw"}],"Transcript":"
Welcome to Life Leadership, Innovation Ventures and Entrepreneurship, a podcast
\nthat showcases the talents, skills and abilities of beauty, faculty, staff and students.
\nI’m your host, Brandon Jones, associate director for Student Learning and Development in Housing and Dining.
\nAnd we’re excited to have you listening to us. All right.
\nWelcome, everybody, to another addition of Life, Leadership, Innovation Ventures and
\nEntrepreneurship podcast sponsored by the University Housing and Dining.
\nI’m your host. Brendan Jones, associate director for Student Learning and Development. And today is the
\nwhat I’m calling graduation addition of the podcast. By the time
\nthis episode comes out, graduation at U.T. will have occurred and life
\nwill be different for Texas exes. And so I wanted to feature somebody
\nwho I really felt like, you know, needed to be gassed up, a.k.a.
\ngets get a little bit of a spotlight and really maximized their
\nstudent experience while they were at the university. And so I have with me today
\nnone other than Agent be real. I was a graphic design major,
\nformer graphic design major at u._t. Now has a Bachelor of Fine Arts degree in design
\nfrom the great city of Waco, Texas. With that 3.5 GPA
\nand member of the Onyx Honor Society, the Johanna’s Leonardo Design
\nIntern, the Fryer’s Society, the T\u00e9 Half Club Adele scholar and also
\nhas its own Web site, it adamant that come and we’ll make sure that that’s in the liner notes for you. So
\nwithout further ado, I want to introduce everybody to agent, the real agent.
\nHow are you doing today? I know. Thank you for that introduction, Brandon. I really appreciate it.
\nIt’s my pleasure. It is my pleasure. Congratulations on graduating. How does it feel to be on
\nthe other side? It feels good. It’s a big relief. No more classes.
\nDon’t have to think about registering for anything anymore. It’s yeah, it’s a nice feeling.
\nIt’s really great. Well, good, good. So we’re gonna dove in and we’ll get to obviously the things
\nthat you’re currently working on. We’re going to dove in and talk about, you know,
\nthe post-graduation experience trying to finish school in the middle of a pandemic.
\nGo talk about that. But we definitely got to talk about a couple of things that are near and dear to my
\nheart. And one of the things that I mean, you were always an active student. I’ve been here since 2017.
\nAnd you’ve always been a student that’s active and engaged in you can be found doing the
\nwork, not really doing a ton of talking. But the one project that I really fell in love
\nwould of yours is the black yearbook. And when I heard that you were doing it, I was like, oh, my gosh,
\nthis is gonna be amazing. I can’t wait to see what comes of this. Can you tell the audience,
\nwhat is the black yearbook? What did you do? What inspired you to start that?
\nAnd then when is it coming out? That’s what they were inquiring minds want
\nto know, brother. When you saw that, give us all the tea. Go ahead. Yeah.
\nSo the black yearbook is a fine art piece. A lot of people, when they hear it, they
\nimmediately think like, oh, a traditional yearbook, which is dope. But when I was thinking
\nabout doing this project, I really wanted to create something that was going to speak larger
\nvolume than, you know, what a typical your book does, which is kind of convey the,
\nyou know, the surface level of what happens on a campus. And this has
\nactually been a project best two years in the making. So for two years, I’ve kind of been grooming this idea.
\nIt didn’t actually start out as the Black Year, but last year, actually, I did a project called
\nwhen I was doing my research, I signed up for this advanced photo class and they’re signing up
\nfor that class. I never taking a photo class because it’s my first time
\nreally being in that photo environment. So I’ve always taken pictures. I always kind of
\nbeen part of that community and out of the blue. I took this class saying
\nits thesis based. So, you know, you pick a topic and then you go from there. So I want to talk about
\nblack men and women and be like, what does that really mean? What does that look like? And, you know, I start taking
\npictures in my classes like, you know, you say your work is about base, but like, you’re ending up in
\na completely different space visually. So for me, it was kind of like a reckoning, like,
\nOK. Like I’m saying, that’s one thing, but what am I actually capturing? So kind of made me think more
\ncritically about my work. And after that, I started
\ndiving deep into expanding that. And then, you know, we had to back up a lot
\nof our images by research. And I found out that in the fall of. Twenty
\nseventeen. Only nine hundred twenty five black men had enrolled at the university. And so for
\nme, it was just like really shocking. I don’t think a lot of people
\nknow that number, that that’s a very shocking number. That’s, you know, that’s very
\nsmall. And you can fit all of the black men in Hog Auditorium seats left over. And that was really
\nthe part that got me was cause, you know, we have culture shock and horror about it. And
\nwhen I put that into perspective, I was like, wow, like, that’s not a lot of black men.
\nYou know, not all those people necessarily identify with, you know, everything that is black
\nat u._t. So when you really think about it, how many black men you’re seeing in front of your face every
\nday? It’s not that many. So from there, I showcase that work at the
\nGeorge Washington Carver Museum in East Austin. That’s kind of like my first time ever
\ndisplaying it publicly. And I really liked putting out white got there, guy.
\nGreat feedback, great responses from students saying, I think I was kind of overwhelmed a little
\nbit with the positive responses because I think at the time I had never really saw myself
\nas someone who could, you know, make such an impact with my work. But then, you know,
\nafter a while, after seeing what I had really done, I started that might a little bit more
\nby rewinding a little bit back in last December.
\nI never dine at film photography before. I’d always done digital. And so
\nmy professor as I had I think you should try film. This would be a good challenge for you. You’ll really
\nget a lot out of this. So this is my first time really dabbling with that. And if anybody’s ever shot
\nfilm photography, you know, it’s it’s a challenge. I. You make a mistake best
\nyou know, best the mistake. And sometimes, yeah, sometimes it’s happy mistakes. Sometimes
\nit’s like bad mistakes. And so it was a real learning curve for me, learning how to color
\nimages, all these like really nitty gritty things. So for me, in the post of
\nall of that, I was kind of thinking, you know, where can this work really go? I
\nhad already gotten like a great response from everyone. And people were, you know, wondering what the next thing was going to
\nbe. And so from there I said, OK, I’ll do a project about all black
\nstudents. And the name didn’t even really come to me until,
\nlike, right before school started. It was very random. I just so happened to be sitting at home and I
\nwas like, this is kind of like a black yearbook in a way. Like this is a compilation of like experiences,
\nmoments, different things that are happening in people’s lives. And so I really
\nkind of just stumbled upon that title and I was like this white, this really works for this. So
\nI ended up fundraising about five thousand dollars to do like the production for
\nlike the images scanning, developing all that stuff. And so through that, I was able
\nto take pictures of students using photography. I got over 200 images.
\nAnd with the help of one of my friends, Shaye, we interviewed 100 black students. So
\nthe narratives are powerful. It’s it’s such a wide variety of
\nof people like there. I don’t think there is one collective
\nstream of consciousness. And that’s kind of what I’m trying to prove with this project is that like, you know, blackness
\nisn’t this monolithic thing. We’re not this caricature that you see in popular media.
\nWe’ve progressed past that. I think it’s time people see that like in totality. So
\nthat’s part of one of the larger motivations for doing this project. That’s awesome. So you said a lot
\nthere and I don’t know you good. You good. Because. Because here’s the thing.
\nThe reason why I wanted you to open up with that is because I know that there are going to be students right
\nnow attending orientation sessions. Right. That are going to be listening to this. They’re going to be students
\nstarting classes whenever they choose to listen to this episode. And they’re going to be wondering
\nhow they’re going to fit at a place like U.T. or if they’re a black student at any school,
\nfor that matter. Cause this this is this podcast isn’t just limited to folks here at our university.
\nWhile we feature folks at our university, there’s gonna be students everywhere listening to this. And so what
\nI’m wanting people to see, especially our black students when they arrive, almost call on our on their college
\ncampuses wherever they are. I want them to start thinking about, you know, what are some experiences
\nthat they can take advantage of. You talked about not having any experience with film photography.
\nAnd so from a generational standpoint, when I was a graphic design major,
\nyou know, that’s why we had was built digital photography came
\nalong later, but they wouldn’t let us take digital until we took film, just like they
\nwouldn’t let us get behind a computer screen until we took 2D. Does that, too. We took 2D, 3D
\nbasic drawing, advanced all of it, though. And so, you know, it’s just funny how I see it, how some things
\nare the same. But what was it like being. In that film photography
\nclass, because that one thing that college students that I work with struggle a lot
\nwith is being comfortable with being uncomfortable. Talk to me about what you learned
\nin that film photography class about stretching yourself and being uncomfortable. Right.
\nSo my main first critique, I kind of got the fire lit right underneath
\nme and they said, oh, have your prints ready for class.
\nAnd I was like, OK, you know, I went to my printer, print out the pictures and, you know,
\npinned them up on the wall. And I looked to the left and to the right. And everyone has these, like, really
\nnice giant, you know, premium luster prints on the wall. Now, I’m confused because I’m
\nlike, I didn’t know that was kind of how we were doing that. So, you know, there are moments
\nwhere I really had to push myself to pick up of like two
\nyears worth of material in the span of a couple of weeks in order to play catch
\nup to that process. So I think part of it was just being open to learning
\nand kind of understanding that like I am allowed to make these mistakes like nobody’s perfect.
\nAnd through that process, I really just wanted to I was open to the entire thing.
\nLike even if it was uncomfortable, I just kept an open mind about, you know, accepting
\nthat I didn’t know what I was doing. I think that was a big part of it was like accepting
\nthat I didn’t know everything that I thought I knew about photography. I didn’t know about the time I’ve been
\nshooting digital for so long. Not very comfortable there. And then I started doing film. I was very
\nuncomfortable there. And so allowing myself to be uncomfortable so that I could grow
\nas an artist was something that was really important, too. And I think that’s the important part about
\nbeing in a learning environment. And for the folks who are faculty and staff or
\nwherever they find themselves today, a part of an organization, a learning organization, it’s all
\nabout those learning opportunities. And I think that too many times people, because of
\nthe lack of familiarity or an unwillingness to stretch and grow, miss out on some key opportunities
\nto grow in their respective disciplines or in their respective crafts to
\nlike stretch. And so I really appreciate you sharing that with us, especially. I cannot emphasize
\nthat enough, especially for our students are listening to this. And so I really
\nthank you for taking on the black yearbooks. So let’s get to the tea portion of that.
\nLike we were hearing about it. I know Black Dee has been gas and this low says
\nwe heard about it. Right. I know, man. When does the black you go?
\nYeah. So. Yeah. That’s best. The question of the summer right now. So
\nI will be officially done with the book at the end of this month. And that’s like
\nall the design elements, the photo elements. And it takes some time to really, you
\nknow, there’s a lot of care going into everything. And
\nwhen I started working on this book, there is a lot of me
\ntrying to pull references for things that like I like different design treatments that I thought would be
\nuseful for conveying this message. And, you know, part of my inspiration
\nbehind it is like I’ve never seen a book about black people being
\nmade in the same style that I’ve really seen books be made about
\nupper echelon like white people. And so that’s a big chunk of
\nmy inspiration. Is I. Is it maybe similar to what can they Wiley does or this painting? Yeah.
\nExactly. Yeah, it’s the exact same thing inside. You know, if
\nblack people want to believe that they can be presented in this same way that
\nthis more renaissance style in a way that, you know, is deemed more polished
\nand this like higher art form than, you know, let’s give ourselves that treatment.
\nAnd it’s not to say that any of the other stuff that we’ve done is any less great,
\nbut I do think there’s something to be said to kind of take those things and be a little tongue
\nin cheek about it, especially because we’re in an era now where everything’s being challenged.
\nYou know, you’re having photographers shoot for some of the largest fashion publications for the very first time,
\nblack photographers. And that’s becoming more and more common. So in a way, it’s kind
\nof like proving that, you know, we can. We always could walk that walk if we wanted to.
\nAnd we’ve never needed to rely on those things to kind of tell our story. But
\nthe reason that I kind of choose to lean into that is because, you know, again, going back
\nto the idea that blackness isn’t this monolithic thing. The important
\npart for me with the interviews and the imagery was that none of it would be similar. It
\nall needed to have this eclectic feel. And so all of my images
\nare unique. All of my so they’re all in different photo styles. They’re not all one
\nconsistent photo style. Not answering the same camera. All of the
\ninterviews, they all have different type sets are very unique, personalized to whatever the interview
\nis. So each of those elements is very much intentionally handled
\nwith a lot of care. I have two other designers that are helping me as well. And so we’ve
\nspent a lot of time just talking about, you know, how. Whenever you’re
\nwhenever you open a book, they’re especially like larger books that tend
\nto have the textbook format on tiny typography,
\nsimilar type based. Whenever you see that, it can be a little intimidating or you just generally don’t want
\nto read it. And so we’ve really been going above and beyond our means to really
\nhave a lot of this these type elements jump out at you. And I guess to answer your question
\non when the book is going to be released, there will be in a large
\nupdate in the middle of July and there will be a lot of things
\nthat will be coming out. Yeah, I can’t say too much because they
\ndon’t die so slow. So I take it that you’ve got a publishing deal. I take
\nI take it that you’ve got a publisher. I might have worked on something.
\nOK. A.J., I know a lot of nobodies. I’m not messing up.
\nNobodies. Cause you. We look at each other to the care of
\nYahoo! Trying to figure out what’s going on. I’m getting the look that I need to just back off and let my brother
\ndo. I’m not trying to ruin nobody’s publishing deal. We’ve got this young brother, you
\nknow, just graduated, got a potentially, quote unquote, potentially
\ngot a publishing deal in the works. All I want to know is when I buy my copy notice
\nI said by ja, don’t hear me asking. I look up the connection.
\nI said, when we buy. So let let’s buy and support this young man
\nwhen we buy it. I just got a can a brother get a signed copy. That’s all I know. Absolutely. OK.
\nI care about. Listen, honey. You know everybody on campus who publishes like Dr. Joseph
\nor Dr. Reddick, Dr. Coakley and others when they publish in these books, I try to make it
\na point to get these signatures, because one thing that happens in Utah is a place
\nlike no one. So many talented students, so many means that these students are doing
\namazing things. And that’s one of my inspirations for doing this podcast. But also, I try to encourage
\nstudents at every school I’ve ever worked at. Take advantage of this. Now, like many
\npeople like Adrian’s now and others like Lee, who
\ndeveloped the pop app, we had him on our first episode of the show, Meet AMI and Cameron.
\nYou know, now her before I Google up and make it big, you know, had them on the show awhile back.
\nAnd so I’m trying to encourage students to make the most of this kind of experience,
\nlike what you’ve done. And I as a father, that’s important to me as well, because, you know
\nyou know, my kids aren’t college age in any sense of the word yet. But I’m thinking about, you know, if I want
\nmy son and my daughter to, you know, express themselves to the world, I want to make sure that
\nthey do doing it like you do it. Because. I wish I could go back to 0 5
\nand 0 6, man, and go back to my undergrad at ACSU and
\nsit in the lab a little bit longer and listen to my advisor with my advisor told me,
\nPrince, go and die. So learn to live, do better. We not going to listen to
\nmy advice and say, Hey, man, you know, I really think you should get in the way. But I think you should,
\nyou know, jump into a digital home like me and not print, print, whatever. Man, this is thousands
\nof years and left. I graduated. Apple announced that the pay
\nand I’m like anybody is the hardest thing is weak. And by December,
\nyour time is right over there. Oh, I got one right over here, you know? And I just. But at
\nfirst would be and so be like high go about it. And then that same year, my alma mater
\ngot a contract with AT&T so that incoming class could either get an iPhone,
\niPod, or they could buy up here if they wanted one. And then a New York
\nTimes auto major publications were switching to digital subscriptions. And I’m like
\nI just watched the whole industry change right after I graduated. So I.
\nWhen a pandemic. But it was definitely a shift. And I knew I was going into education afterwards
\nanyway. But because this was my primary major, I was like, man. So you
\ntalked about Kehinde Wiley. And for those of you who don’t know who kill him while day is Kahane, Wiley is
\na Laybourne Brooklyn stationed
\npainter. And the painting that most people would probably know Kahane wildly for is
\nthe Obama. Picture with the floor print in the background is phenomenal.
\nI love it. And you know and I love him de Whiley style. So thank
\nyou for pointing out other black RDC agent. Don’t throw it shares the
\nlove of a shout-outs to black artists over here. So.
\nAnother thing you talked about that I want to I want to give you a chance to talk a little bit more on
\nis your style, because I’m hearing you say that you want
\nto. You didn’t allow yourself to be combat confined to the traditional norms
\nof just this box, the in brick,
\nsame times. New Roman font name picture. That’s it. Yearbook style.
\nLike you you have it. You’re gonna have various types that you’re going to use, different colors,
\nyou’re gonna do different interview styles. And in our training as designers, typically
\nit’s very easy to get box and right. It’s the best, especially depending on the company or the organization
\nyou’re choosing to design or work for. There’s these conventions and these stylistic norms that
\nI’ve seen black artists quit school over because the academy boxes, the men
\ntalk to the students out there who might be considering graphic design or those students
\nwho already are doing it. But, you know, they they they want to continue doing it on the site.
\nHow do you how do you keep from stylistically allowing yourself to get
\nboxed in by the academy? Because they happen a lot. Yeah. It’s really
\nhard. It was difficult for me when I first joined the design program and I was really trying to
\nfind my my ways into the program. And so, you know, they teach
\nyou a lot about brand guidelines and consistency and finding your voice as an artist. But
\nI mean, I’ve been getting told very recently by a lot of creative directors that they think the new
\ngeneral creative can do a lot of different things. And I think that’s
\na very fair assumption. And like when I think about artists like Margaret Zang, she kind of
\nblew up on Tumblr at age 17 and she was in boardrooms at age 17,
\ngiving presentations to these billionaires about how to make their brands better. And it’s like
\nSt. Thomas. And yeah, and it’s like when you hear about people like that and,
\nyou know, you ask them, you know, what’s your advice? They usually tell you, I don’t follow the rules.
\nAnd I think that’s great advice, particularly for designers, artists of all kinds. KS
\nI think, you know, the status quo is always going to go to the window, but I think it’s
\nnice to, I would say, learn all of the traditional things because it’s better
\nto know them than to not know them. Yes. I mean, do what you want after you know the traditional things
\nbecause it doesn’t hurt you to know the bay, the basics, because someone might hire
\nyou. They might pay you really well for knowing the basics. And then they’ll pay you a little extra for being able to
\ndo your own thing and kind of tweak small parts of your work to kind of tailor to
\nthis like this theme that you’re working on. I wish you’d been around to come
\ntell me that the graduate student, because for me, you know, my little cousin
\nis a fine arts major at University of Texas at Tyler, back home in my hometown.
\nAnd I’ve got, you know, as with several of us who majored in either some form of fine arts
\nor graphic design in undergrad. And the common thread that especially,
\nyou know, us being black that we we’ve realized is there’s this imposter
\nsyndrome that shows up because, you know, growing up where I grew up, I didn’t get.
\nI didn’t touch the Apple computer, at least from a design standpoint, until I was 20 years
\nold in college. Most of my peers had been working on Photoshop. And
\nat that time, Macromedia was the big giant doing freehand until
\nAdobe bought everything. And then software was ridiculously expensive. So
\nwhere I’m from, we have access to any of that. And so I was groomed for
\na different track in my high school. So Art, what and what they were pushing me towards, they were pushing me
\nmore towards the STEM disciplines or the medical profession. But graphic design was where
\nmy heart always was. And so there’s gonna be students that show up whose parents
\nare telling them right now. And and I’m but I’ve encountered some of these parents that they can’t make any
\nmoney doing this or that there’s no future in doing this. Talk to those parents
\nright now who are listening, because I’m a parent of a child who I can already see with
\nno training from me and no help my daughter. I can put her at this easel or his
\ndry erase board right now and she’ll go off and just do whole thing.
\nAnd I’m seeing that there’s some things she’s picking up naturally and they’re not. But I’m scared
\nthat I was telling my cousin the other day, I’m scared that I’m gonna ruin it for because
\nthe academy is gonna come out. Those parents and those people who are listening right now,
\nwho are trying to tell your generation and the other younglings
\nin your generation that there’s right in what you do as a designer,
\nthat it needs to be a happy talk to those people right now. Yeah. So
\ngrowing up, my mom was very encouraging of me kind of doing the art,
\nsame kind of participating in everything creative. And then when I got in high school, it
\nflipped and it was like, now my dad’s on that side of my mom’s. Like, no, like, I think you should just
\ngo be an engineer. Like, because I had learned AutoCAD, like, I can do 3D renderings.
\nI don’t like doing it, but I know how to do it. Wow. And so it was something that
\nI really had to decide on my own. I was like, I want to do this. I’m passionate about this. But
\nI will say that, like, I agree with you that that is a comment that, you know, like parents, they
\nI understand the concern and the worry, but still issues. Right. Right. And
\nlike the industry has opened up so much, like everyone’s hiring an art director. Everyone’s hiring a
\nUX designer, a UI designer. It’s there’s nothing there’s nothing more powerful
\nthan being able to sketch out your ideas and bring them to life,
\nbecause seeing is believing a lot of times. And if you can draw it, you can draw. You can do
\nanything. And I think that is my one. Like, if there was one thing
\nthat I would pick on my pants about is not pushing me to keep drawing when I was younger, because,
\nyou know, when we’re in the art core classes, they teach you like, you know,
\nwhen you’re getting clients, it’s not always possible to get the idea in front of them
\nas fast as they want it. And the next best thing to be able to communicate that idea is being able
\nto draw you, being able to do a sketch. Being able to do a mockup like all those things that kind
\nof give you a skeleton for your idea is so important. And
\nI will say a lot of the work that I’ve gotten in the creative space is solely because I’ve I’ve just
\naxed and I’ve just thrown the ideas out there and because I had a loose framework of what I wanted
\nto do. People just say yes. Yeah. And they kind of understand it. And I’m able to articulate it cause
\nI can draw my ideas out. I can put them on paper. People get it, though. OK. I see what you’re doing.
\nYou know, so it becomes easier. And I think this idea that there
\nisn’t any money in the creative, though, this is a giant myth. And yes,
\nI think it’s something that I personally have kind of made it my mission to. You know, anytime
\nI encounter like a young black creative, I’m like, no. Yes. Like, come to the creative space,
\nbecause I will say they’re very, very few black
\ncreatives that are creative directors or are designers in general. They’re very
\nlike scarce. And you just because of the fact that, you know, this myth is like pushed off on
\npeople. You know, it’s fine to go to school, get a business degree and decide you want to do it,
\ndo design or photography after I’ve encountered a lot of people that end up doing that.
\nAnd I’m always surprised when their undergrad is in, you know, business. But I think
\nthe conversation I always end up having with them is them saying they wish I would have done what I did
\nbecause I’ve been a day. It leaves you more fulfilled, more opportunities, more things to work on.
\nAnd I’ve kind of learned through this college experience is like and this is more I know
\nfor students. But you have to make your college experience work for you, not the other way around.
\nYou like your education should. It shouldn’t be you
\nkind of waiting for your education to serve you, which it sounds backwards. But when
\nyou think about it like you get an assignment and your art career class and they’re like, all right,
\nyour assignment is to create a art piece that
\ncreate a continuous art piece that runs on the page. All right, cool. You can do the very simple thing
\nand do lines running short on the page or you can create something that you could potentially also
\nuse to pitch to a client. And now you you it’s a win win. You pass your
\nassignment and now you have materials that you can actually use for your portfolio. So
\nI think through going through all these classes and, you know, having small, petty
\nbeef with professors about what I want, what I’m interested in. Yeah. All
\nright. You’re not my fault. Right. You have to show them that you really want to, Dan. I think
\nthe moment I started fighting for the projects that I wanted to work on improving to them,
\nthat I could accomplish those things. And just honestly, just doing it. They stop
\nfighting me so much about it. And so I will say, you know, the fear that
\nthere aren’t any career opportunities in the creative space. I think they’re very reasonable. I have a lot
\nof friends who do you x design. And, you know, they make six figure salaries. John,
\nI could go. Do you X? Any day. But that’s not something that I’m interested in. So. Right.
\nBut you know what, Dr. Moore, tell us all the time and pursue your passion, not the paper.
\nLook. Yeah. And it’s like those are great opportunities
\nand they lead to great things. But I think that, you know, where you really find something
\nand you just you keep sharpening that one skill down to the T. You become
\nso limitless with what you can really do it. And I think that’s what’s,
\nyou know, kind of made my passion kind of grow out of control is that, you know,
\nI started doing something and I was like, wow, I really like this. Let me invest them myself, invest
\nin my passion. And you really start to see a lot of the benefits from a licensing
\nagency and just reached out to me about my photographs like, hey, we want to license your images.
\nAnd it’s all because, you know, they find my right through other publications. Then they start looking at my portfolio.
\nAnd so, you know, in the process, you know, trying to put
\nmyself out there and give myself more exposure. Other people will find you along the way. So
\nI think where I used to be worried or struggling or trying to figure out what’s
\nreally next, you kind of just learn the same day they say about life is that it’s really a journey.
\nThere’s no one particular road map. You can roadmap it out all day.
\nYou can literally do all day. But life will always be a journey. You know, always have twists and turns.
\nIt’s not linear, man. I tell us. You may have heard me say this. I tell students success is not this
\nlinear thing. Does not this point A, point B. And then you get to see the graduation is like now.
\nYou may get a point, a an endpoint, a squared three block or
\nit may go all over the place. And ultimately you may get to that point. But, you know, I
\ngive the example of how, you know, when I was in undergrad, I wanted to design shoes
\nfor Nike. Like I was in love with Tinker Hatfield was doing with Jordans.
\nI had looked at Scoop Jackson’s book, The Sole Influence on
\nall 30 years of Nike Nike shoes. And I’m like, I’m going to the University of Florida
\nand for my masters and I’m going to work for Nike. But I’m a find my way
\nback into higher education. I might teach classes or something, a workout like that. But
\nfor me, it was always that thing. I’m like, I gotta create. I got to create. And for me,
\nthe creative solution to what I do in education, I always bring that to the table, you know, and people,
\nyou know, when it when to every job I’ve been hired for. I tell people I’m like, look, you get two for one.
\nYou’ve got somebody who’s gonna think critically and can work the academy. But I’m gonna
\ncome to the table being able to be that person, to go talk to the marketing office and my marketing team.
\nShout out to the marketing team in housing and dining. They love me because I can speak the language. I can come
\nin there and say, hey, this is the kind of project we want. Already know the color palette
\nare, you know, red hex codes and the Pantone matching system. No,
\nI already know what font. I know all of this stuff already coming in. So
\nprojects that I get to do and be a part of have been phenomenal, especially here
\nat see like even this podcast where I went to our marketing team and told them this is what I want to do. They were the ones
\nthat helped me come up with the title. They created the graphic. We got a show now. And so
\nI’m with you. I tell parents all the time. I was like, y’all, I’m doing a podcast. I help create
\npromotional graphics. I design my own flyers for events. And they were like, who
\ndid I get to design it? I was like like, Panopto these out.
\nI’m like, oh, no, this degree is going to get put to use. But I also think what you said is critical
\nin that when you said and I may title the episode this you said
\ndon’t follow the rules because that’s the truth. Drawing
\nis easy to get boxed in with that. But if you just let go and loosen up that you have
\nthe most fun doing it right. I really like that. Now we’re talking about following the rules.
\nYou know, when it comes to art and all these other different things. But I also want you to spend a couple of minutes
\ntalking to us about being a black creative today, because you hear that title, especially
\nfrom your generation lot about I’m on Twitter, I’m an influencer
\non Instagram, I’m a black. And that has taken on a different meaning
\nfrom when I was in school, not even 20 years ago. I mean, when it wasn’t even 20 years like this,
\nwe’re talking about less. Less than 20. Like less than fifteen, to be exact, because I graduated in 2006
\nfrom undergrad. And being a black creative, they admit you were either a graphic designer,
\nyou were a somebody who did television and radio or film.
\nBut there was no there was a YouTube, but there was like not folks like us with our own channels
\nand subscriptions and not it was very few like Ryan Leslie would have been. A prime example
\nof somebody like that. Talk to me about what it means to you to be a black creative
\ntoday in 2020. Yeah. So, yeah, it it sometimes
\nit feels like a loaded term almost because, you know, black creatives and by
\nthe social media definition do everything they do photography,
\ngraphic design, marketing, social media coordination. They do
\neverything you need. They can do it. And I really admire that. Like hustle,
\nbecause it’s I think it’s opened up so many spaces for black
\npeople, like just showing that, you know, where it came, just as capable as the next person, a
\nkind of doing some of these things. I think that’s really important. And, you know, I often hear,
\noh, there’s not enough room for everybody to do this thing. And, you know, there is
\nthere’s enough people with ideas and startups like they’re there.
\nI feel like there’s every every week there’s a new startup that is being
\nstarted by a black student. And I think that that’s something that a lot of people
\ndon’t consider, particularly like the amount of creative work that has
\nto go into a new website. Your logo, your app, your colors, your inspiration, your concept.
\nAnd people need black creatives for that work. And so the white collar
\nrang. Exactly. And so I think one thing I’ve kind of learned
\nis that I’ve been trying to make sure not to, you know, undermine
\nmy own capabilities, especially when I’m like I’m approached.
\nIt can be very easy to kind of, you know, put your stuff down if it’s a high level client
\nand someone that you already know has like a big name and the expectations are really high.
\nAnd so I think, you know, validating yourself is one way to kind of like stay
\nout of that. Right. Is that important? I want you to talk about why that’s important, because I
\nfell into that. And I wish somebody as creative as yourself
\nhad come a lot was around for me to look to and go, OK, I can
\nlook at where Adrian is doing. And Adrian is like uplifted us and call it.
\nIt’s like, hey, we can do this. Why is it important to affirm and validate
\nyourself and to not undermine your abilities when the big name
\nclient or somebody with a lot of pool and resources is coming along? Why is that important?
\nPhil? Absolutely right on. Well, I think for one, you know, if they’re there,
\nthey’re talking to you, they approach you, they’re following you, they’re liking your content. They’re there for a reason.
\nAnd it’s not by mistake that, you know, they found you by any means. And, you know,
\nand a lot of my work when I was like starting to write about, like, you know, black people
\nand you know what we really stand for. I started capitalizing black because it’s
\nan affirmation of identity that we’re here and it’s more directly associated with
\nthe culture as opposed to the color. And so for me, that was something that
\nI started doing for my identity. And I just think that’s important for, you
\nknow, the sake of that part of yourself, especially at UTF.
\nLike that’s something that can be it can sometimes get lost in translation a lot
\nof times. And, you know, I think it’s important to emphasize that, like you’re a black designer, you’re
\na black created because people will try and take that away from you and they’ll try to rebrand
\nyou as something else. So before anybody even gets the opportunity to, you know,
\ndefine you and set the standard for you, you can already tell them my business, who I am or like this is
\nI work. This is how I define myself in this space. And I
\nthink best is really important. And, you know, being a black creative doesn’t look the same
\nfor everyone. Come on. I don’t think that there’s one particular way to be
\na black creative. Mm hmm. And I think that you can do it so many different ways. We have stylists
\non campus, rap hairstyles, rap makeup artists. Are we doing you know, though,
\nsome of these people do this just for fun. It’s like a side hobby to them. It doesn’t take away,
\nyou know, the talent that they have. And I think that’s what the real difference is
\nbetween, you know, someone who does it for two hours a week as opposed to 40 hours a week.
\nAnd then there’s like, you know, the natural talent and the raw talent. And, you know, someone
\nwho learned these skills over time. And, you know, photography is one thing that I would say I learned over
\ntime. But my eye for seeing things that, you know, are aesthetically pleasing,
\nthat’s something that always kind of had. And I think you have to kind of recognize what
\nyou have that makes you special, that makes your work different from everybody else’s.
\nDoes your work, though? When I look at your photography. Because I’ve been watching you
\nfor a while now. Yeah. What drew me to your work was your eye. I would
\nlook at photography and I’m like, because I’m somebody that when I took photography,
\nI’m like, look, my you know, me and the aperture and all that stuff. I’m like, cool. I could I can
\nzero in. I can pan better than most. I said, but one thing I know I have
\nas like an eye undermined it to your point was that I had, but not just not the detail
\nper say, but more so. Like I can be out and talking in my life and be like, you see something, don’t you?
\nI’m like you. I can capture it. Like, Yeah, I see it. I see the moment and I capture
\nit the way I want to. And that’s something that drew me to your work. Was your eye for
\nthe right angle or. Oh, my God, that light is here to get the perfect time. Let me get this now.
\nThat’s something that I really liked about your work. And so I appreciate the fact that
\nyou just go where you need to go with it. Like there’s no when I try. I tried to. Which
\nI don’t do for anybody. I try. I try my hardest to make sure that I don’t box anybody into a style.
\nAnd I think that’s what I appreciate about your work, is that if somebody were to ask me, like, how would you define Adrien?
\nI’m like, I’m. I’m like, I’m not going to say post-modern or or, you know,
\nthat reform is hard. It’s like not it’s a it’s dream. Like this
\nis how Adrien sees the world. And so it could be this is what this is what Adric felt like at four
\no’clock on a Friday in June versus now with Agent Junior year after
\nafter the Cavanaugh’s stuff was going down, all campuses, something like that, like it varies. And that’s what
\nI like about your style. So kudos to you for being true to how you felt in the moment and
\ncredit you for being true to this is how you want to show up
\nin this space. And I think that that’s important and it’s going to transition me to the next question. I want to get somewhere.
\nIt’s something you talked about which is so important. And we say this a lot
\non social media. We say this a lot on insecure. So that’s easy, right? We say
\nthis a lot in black and in predominantly black spaces. But I wonder what people
\nmean when they talk about you said showing up in this
\nspace, showing up create in the creative spaces and inviting others into that space.
\nWhy? Right. Important to identify
\nthe space and owning the space and presenting yourself in in these
\nspaces as a black artist or a black brand or style is why is it
\nimportant to do that? Yeah, it will. I’ll tell you a short story
\nby whenever. So I think it was last year over.
\nWant to say like right before New Year’s, I went and I visited New York and I’m visiting L.A. right after because I
\nwas scoping out for internships, meeting with different offices, trying to see which one I liked the most.
\nAnd so when I went there in Texas, ex actually DME
\nwas MSJ at Royal. He does video work, a lot of photography, a lot of production as well.
\nAnd he was like, hey, I really like your work. Less like chat whenever you get back to
\nAustin and then we can talk and I can try and connect you to like of people that, you know, expand your work.
\nAnd, you know, I think part of what was so special about that
\nwas seeing how he’s owned his own presence in the space. It’s important
\nbecause, you know, when you see someone owning that space is like, wow, like carries himself
\nwith so much confidence. I can do that, too. There’s no reason why I couldn’t do that.
\nAnd what made it even more special was Texas eggs. And so there are a lot of like relatable
\nmoments. He started in photography as well. Chandler’s it’s a video. And so for me
\nto see another black man kind of doing what I want to do is like, wow, like the only thing
\nreally holding me back. And Jared told me that’s the only thing really holding me back is me. I have the work.
\nI have the eye for it. All I need to do is step into this space and say, this is who I am.
\nAnd sometimes it takes, you know, meeting someone like that for you to take that next
\nstep, to go shoot with agency, send this email. Meet this person.
\nAnd that’s important. No, Jared does really great work and he’s
\ntried to bring me on to other projects I’ve got to work with. I’m alone this past year and stuff.
\nAnd so I think it’s just been really, really nice to see how he’s
\nkind of helped me try and better understand my own placement within this space.
\nAnd he’s like, yeah, like, if you want something, go for it. Like you’re talented. Like, there’s no reason why you can’t
\ndo what the next person is doing. So now know, it’s like all the ideas that I
\nalways think are kind of like unattainable or unreachable. He’s like, no. Like, you know,
\nmake a pitch and then send it. So and, you know, I’ve gotten great feedback from a lot
\nof that stuff. So I’ve always kind of just thought that. And. I met him, I
\nkind of just thought, you know, you needed to be discovered on Instagram, Twitter. Like, yeah, something like
\nthat, which a handful of people do get discovered that way. But I mean, a lot of it is like
\nknowing the right person, the email and a lot of times that’s what it boils down to. So I think
\nI stopped undermining, you know, by just being who I am and really giving
\nin to that. And, you know, a lot of my work and my ideas are
\nlike solely inspired by music that I listen to. And you
\nknow, that the fact that jazz works in music, I kind of helped me find a way
\nto bridge that, to find my place more. And this music area
\nby you know, when I’m thinking about images and songs come to mind because
\nwhen I visualize the images, I was listening to this song. So I may not remember what
\nsong it is for SMK image by you know, at some at that point in time,
\nI was most definitely listening, listening to a song or thinking about a song. And it’s about
\ntrying to convey those moments to really humanize that person.
\nAnd I think that’s like the if I had to pick, you know, one thing that’s similar in all
\nmy images, it’s the humanizing quality and all of them. Everything is very human. It’s not
\ntoo pompous or it’s not too dry. There’s always
\nthat like human factor. There’s like this moment where you see
\nit and you kind of empathize a little bit with the image. And so that’s something that I’ve always
\ntried to do in my work. Yeah, I I really just think that
\nwhen you’re owning a space and really just going for it is important
\nbecause people will. People will sometimes kind of
\ndecide how they’re going to respond based on, you know, your confidence level. How much of you are you?
\nAnd I was talking to this guy yesterday about working on
\na project. And he was like I emailed him a couple of times and he finally
\ngot back to me. I emailed him like once a week almost. And he finally got
\nback to me. Knows I like your tenacity, like. Hop on a car, man. You know how I kind of just given
\nup and said, no more shy about my approach. I said, hey. Like, I understand if you’re busy
\nand you don’t want to it, so you don’t have to do any of that. You can kind of put your offer out in the front
\nand say, hey, this is who I am. This is what I want to do. Here’s my idea. You know, if you’re interested, let
\nme not load up on a car and you can go. There’s nothing wrong with following up and doing all
\nthose things. And so through this process, I’m just kind of really learn to own who
\nI say I am as much as I can. That’s you know, it’s funny you should say that because that’s how I got
\nmy internship at a design firm where I was living it, because
\nall during undergrad, like at least that last I’d say that last
\nsemester of my junior year out, they came and visited and I’d reach out constantly
\nlike every month. Hey, you have an internship spot. You have internships by. And then finally,
\nmy senior year, they gave me one and they said, I really admire your tenacity. He said
\nmost of your classmates usually give up after the first first two emails.
\nAnd I just I contacted a mom like I’d see them out in public. I’m like, hey, is this a small
\ntown? I’m like, hey, how you doing? You got you got anything over? Yeah. And I just I go because I really wanted
\nthat experience of being in a farm and that it was a was that experience. Not that it was bad,
\nbut it was that experience that let me know. I couldn’t do this full time because I’m like
\nI’m too I’m too energetic for this and being confined to this space here, too
\nmuch for me. And so I’m like, I need to be able to come and go as I need to. And I thought I could do that in
\nthat role. So I knew full time work wasn’t for me, but I knew freelance was because I could
\ntake on the projects I wanted and I could create a work and it’d be, you know, the vision
\nthat I want. Of course, what the client needs as well. I appreciate you sharing that. I think the last
\nthing I want to talk to you about, two things, really. One. Tell everybody
\nabout startand the onix Honor Society, because and the significance
\nof that specifically here you take if you’re going to have students that are going to take advantage of experiences
\nthat you may have students who ultimately get inducted into onix after listening to this
\npodcast. And so I’d love for them to hear that as you were one of the co-founders
\nof this organization. Tell us about onix. Yeah. So onix is one
\nof or is YouTube’s first black honor society. U-2’s never had a black
\nhonor society before. And Bagian, I founded onix because we felt like there was a need
\nfor you know, there’s a lot of discourse that happens on Twitter. And we felt like there
\nwas a need for that energy to be put into something that.
\nCould lead to something greater. You know, our community is facing a lot of issues right now,
\nparticularly as we’re starting to talk about what changes can be made at the university level.
\nHow are we trying to honor the presence of black students more? And I think there are leaders like Simona
\nHarry within onix that are at my helm of really just,
\nyou know, standing their ground and standing firm. And I really do think that’s way
\nmakes onix different from a lot of other black organizations, is that, you know, we’re not,
\nyou know, trying to ah, you know, we do bring people together. But that’s not our main focus.
\nOne of our main focus is really to advocate and try and create a space that makes this more welcoming for
\nstudents, because I think a lot of times there are students who get lost in the void
\nof everything because, you know, you can be a tunnel for a lot of people.
\nBut onix is really an organization that’s been trying to champion, you know, opening up the space
\nto be a light in a way. So I think, you know, when those issues do come up, you know,
\nwe see them, we talk about them and we presented to whoever. So I think that’s one of the
\nreasons that we started onix. I also think it’s important that, you know, there
\ncentralized leaders that you can kind of look to whenever you’re trying to get those initiatives passed
\non me recently. I think S.G. is kind of giving black student
\norganizations a more prominent space with energy. And it’s like, well,
\nwhy did it take a, you know, a thing like this for to have space in HD?
\nAnd, you know, it’s very different from, you know, in the past I’ve seen them advocate for certain things.
\nBut you’re not bringing the right black students into the room. You know, the black students that have been talking
\nabout these things for the longest time. And, you know, I think that’s one of the powers of onix is that
\nwe are looking out a lot for, you know, who’s talking about this the most, who
\nis kind of leading the conversation and kind of being a plug to make sure that people are being put into
\nthose rooms because, you know, it kind of defeats the purpose. If, you know, our non-black president and
\nvise president are advocating for black students with no black students in the room. You know, you really
\nyou know, they should be giving opportunities for black students to be in those rooms. And, you know, I
\nwould even almost go as far as to say you don’t need the student body president and vise president in the room. You just
\nyou need the black student leaders in that room. And I even think things like that are,
\nyou know, they shouldn’t be an open conversation mission, even just be left up to
\nthe student leaders. But I think that’s something that Onyx has tried to be consistent about, is
\nwhen we do have a conversation. Everybody’s invited. When we’re talking about solutions, everybody’s invited. And so
\nthere’s never really been a moment with our events where we’re like, OK, actually, we’re just gonna
\ntake this set of people. You’re going to be the one to do this thing. So
\nI think we’re trying to create a space that really elevates the black community.
\nA lot of our programing council for the spring, obviously because of Kogut, but we’re actually planning
\na black State of the Union where we’re going to connect with the city of Austin. We had actually formed a formal
\npartnership with the city of Austin, and we’re planning on hosting an event that kind
\nof would bring local black businesses in and try and bridge that gap.
\nBecause I do think there is, you know, some sort of gap there between what’s happening in Austin
\nand black students on campus. Yeah. So we really want there to be a bridge. Right.
\nSo, I mean, that’s really the driving force behind onix and trying to be a guidepost
\nfor a lot of students. Really. Excellent. Thank you for sharing. And I think that’s important for everybody
\nlistening to know that these are student lit like people like myself who work for the university.
\nWe’re not the ones out there creating that because we can only do so much. But when students come to the table
\nfor justice for the staff that are listening, it’s important to hear this English create space.
\nAs Adrian said, for students to articulate like these are our needs. You know, I read
\nthe list of the formal requests from the student athletes earlier today, and I thought it was well articulated.
\nI thought that, you know, personally, if I can say it, I’m like, they’re not really asking for nothing
\nunreasonable. They got their work cut out for a couple of those things, but they sat down
\nand they put out a formal request. It wasn’t a list of demands. It wasn’t something
\nthat, you know, like Pete, some people are trying to make that out to be. And I think that I love that
\nidea of a black State of the Union. I love the. Even though my my time is up as
\nthe FSA co-president, I do know that the incoming executive board, they
\nthey’ve given some attention to that that has that did not fall on deaf ears. I want you to
\nknow that we heard you all’s request for that. And that is something that I think they’re going to work to try to
\ncreate on campus. I know Dr. Moore for sure is definitely interested in helping you all do something
\nlike this. So please encourage your colleagues who are still around. Encourage him
\nto keep that going. I guess one of the last things I want to give you a chance to do is just kind of tell the people,
\nyou know, what to be on the lookout for from you, how they can follow your work
\nand work it where they can keep up with all of that pressure. Yeah. So you can find me mice
\non social. All my at. Names are the same as my first and last name. 80 R A
\nI N T and then B E R E L no dots and dashes in between.
\nYeah. I’m pretty active on social media. So if we reach out to me I will most definitely see it.
\nYou’ll be on the lookout for an announcement about the black book in the middle of July.
\nWould be something really nice coming. It’s gonna be really, really great. And again, I can’t
\nsay too much, but I think we’re going to be really happy with it. I’m just I’m excited to
\nshare this body of work. I can I guess jopson aspects about, you know, the size
\nof the book. It’s a little over 300 pages. So it’s a lot of work.
\nThere are a number of photos, interviews. So I will say
\nthe books will be in limited quantities. So if when the time comes that, you know, they are released,
\nyou don’t want to miss out on this. There might not be a second job of it. Oh, my.
\nOK. OK. All right. So when this thing drops,
\nget your copy. Like don’t don’t miss out on this. Listen, agent,
\nthank you so much for taking the time to talk with me today. I really enjoyed this. And
\npressure. Yeah. So you can find me much on social as all my ass names
\nare the same as my first and last name. Eighty R A I N T and then B
\nE R E L no dots and dashes in between. Yeah. I’m
\npretty active on social media. So if you reach out to me I will most definitely see it.
\nYou’ll be on the lookout for an announcement about the black book in the middle of July.
\nWould be something really nice coming. It’s gonna be really, really great. And again, I can’t
\nsay too much, but I think we’re gonna be really happy with it. I’m just I’m excited to
\nshare this body of work. I can I guess Johnson expects about, you know, the size
\nof the book. It’s a little over 300 pages. So it’s a lot of work.
\nThere are a number of photos and reviews. So I will say
\nthe books will be in limited quantities. So if when the time comes that, you know, they are released,
\nyou don’t want to miss out on this because there might not be a second job of it. Oh, my.
\nOK. OK. All right. So when this thing drops,
\nget your copy. Like don’t don’t miss out on this. Listen, agent,
\nthank you so much for taking the time to talk with me today. I really enjoyed this and
\neverybody that’s listening. Stay tuned. We got other exciting opportunities coming up.
\nSo keep tuning into the show, agent. Take care. Thank you.
\nWe hope you enjoy today’s episode to catch the next installment. Be sure to follow us on
\nSpotify, Apple podcast, Google Podcasts and Stitcher. This
\npodcast was recorded and edited in collaboration with the L.A. US Development Studios
\nAudio Department. More information can be found at Liberal Arts at Texas Tech. You
\nslash L.A. ideas. The intro song was composed by Ian Herrera and you can
\nfind his work at Ian Herrera dot com. The outro song was composed by Noah Keller
\nand you can find more of his work at Noah D. Color dot com.
\nWe’ll see you next time.<\/p>\n"},"episode_featured_image":false,"episode_player_image":"https:\/\/podcasts.la.utexas.edu\/live\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/24\/2022\/03\/LIVE-logo-TPN.png","download_link":"https:\/\/podcasts.la.utexas.edu\/live\/podcast-download\/43\/episode-5-dont-follow-the-rules.mp3","player_link":"https:\/\/podcasts.la.utexas.edu\/live\/podcast-player\/43\/episode-5-dont-follow-the-rules.mp3","audio_player":"