Episode 7, Part 2: Expert Profile, Dr. Sanford Jeames, Cancer Research Advocate

[0:00:00 Speaker 1] wear a resource for learners, including every member of the live strong cancer institutes. On track, Educational pipeline, from middle school to residency were growing collection of interviews, talks and experiences the uncover the myths and the uncertainties of cancer and careers in cancer in order to empower and inspire generations of thinkers and leaders. This is cancer uncovered, uneducated in an empowerment podcast by the live strong cancer

[0:00:30 Speaker 2] institutes. Hello, Thank you for joining us for another episode of Cancer Uncovered. This is Kristen Win coming to your ears from the University of Texas. Dull Medical school Live Strong Cancer institutes, an emerging cancer center in Austin. In part one of this episode Episode seven. Uncovering Cancer and Health Disparities. We heard from Dr Lillian Noelle and Dr Sandford James, both expert community based cancer researchers who discussed definitions and examples of health disparities in cancer care and cancer research through the lens of their work in different communities in the United States. It’s a powerful episode that you should make sure to go back and check out if you haven’t already. We wanted to share more with you about Dr Sanford James and Dr lately, a Noel’s career journeys and insights for our listeners. The only issue waas their stories and words of encouragement were so insightful I couldn’t bear to try and squish them both into one episode. So in this episode you’ll hear my conversation with Dr James. And then in an upcoming episode, you’ll hear my conversation with Dr Noel. Before we jump in, you will hear Dr James talk about his work as a student and educator. Ah, historian, a clinician, a researcher, a patient advocate. This guy has been around, but I wanted to highlight that. He is also currently a cancer research advocate and what that means, as our listeners discovered the many ways that individuals are making an impact in the name of defying cancer. As defined by the N. C. I. The National Cancer Institute. Research advocates bridge the gap between research and the community at large. They make recommendations and provide strategic advice based on the voices of communities to help shape cancer research and ultimately, the future of cancer treatment and care. I’m excited to share this interview with you. Let’s jump in and say hello to Dr Sanford James. Can you share with us how you got here. How you got to the work that you’re doing now.

[0:02:58 Speaker 0] Well, it’s interesting how I got here and thank you very much for having me join again. I think it’s very important to really discuss how I they say how I got here. I am a instructor with Austin Independent School District. I coordinate the health science program here in East Side Early College High School, and I’m also faculty at Houston Tillotson University here in Austin, Texas. Other than being an educator, I’m also a cancer advocate and a cancer advocate. My journey to become a cancer advocate has been one I never thought that I would probably become. I never knew what a cancer advocate Waas, but I understood and advocate is someone who speaks for other people. And so my background is probably much different than many other medical oncologists, other persons who are affiliated with cancer research. My background primarily is in history. I do have undergraduate and graduate degrees in history and journalism, and that was because of my interest in civil rights. Growing up in Alabama, I went to segregated schools, and I often wondered a lot about what would it be like to be in a more diverse society. And in Alabama at the time that I went to school, there was lots of discussion around integration around equality, particularly around education. And so I naturally I was indoctrinated into really having mawr thoughts about inclusion, particularly for black people in many facets. So our society and so as an educator, naturally, my first interest was to learn more about history and how history plays a part into segregation. How history plays a part also into systemic racism in ways that we probably didn’t realize. And so my backgrounds in history, and then it transferred over the health care.

[0:05:04 Speaker 2] So that’s quite a jump from history Toe Healthcare. Was there a class that you took, or was it somebody you met? When did that happen for you? How did that happen?

[0:05:14 Speaker 0] My background in health care began with my sister. When I was in high school, I did get recruited to play college football, and so I was going to college to play football, and I got to college and I realized that I was too small and not good enough. And so then it became a secondary issue. If I’m not playing football. How will I actually play from college? I did have ROTC in high school. Junior ROTC was, of course, a military program for high school students. And I really enjoyed the military. And I thought, Well, if I joined the military, the military at the time would actually probably pay for college. And that is, in fact, how I actually got into health care. My sister was graduating. She had already graduated. She was a registered nurse in Birmingham, Alabama, and she advised me. She said, If you’re gonna go into the military, think about something that you can do and you can use it when you get out of the military. And I really didn’t know much about healthcare other than what my sister had been doing going to nursing school. And she suggested that I actually consider going into healthcare, and I thought that could be fun could be interesting. And so I chose to actually go into surgery, and I got trained in the United States Army as a surgical assistant. Being a surgical assistant in the Army is is much different than perhaps let’s they go into a community college or a tenable school the military trains their technicians to do procedures, as if the doctor is not going to be there, because if you’re on the front line, you’re in a war. And so I was actually trained very well, and I really became fascinated with surgery. And so I actually had a combination education of history and journalism. While simultaneously I received my diploma from the United States Army as a surgical technician. So therefore, it was really very beneficial because after I graduated from college, I had a degree, and now I’m becoming active duty in the United States military. And ironically, when you work in surgery, you see all different types of cases and procedures, and I’m also thinking about my background in learning about civil rights history, learning about the history of the United States, and I noticed in surgery, I noticed that surgery for cancer people, particularly those who were black surgery, was primarily worse. When I say worse, the cancer was more advanced when I did cancer surgery. But more importantly, Christian, when I would talk to patients and families before a procedure, I would ask them, Do you understand what we’re doing today in your surgery and many times the patients and the family did not really understand the procedure. They knew that their loved one had cancer, but they didn’t understand the ramifications or differences. And so as a result, moving forward many years later. I’m still working in health care, but I’m also teaching. And if you’re an educator, you you’re probably gonna have a second job. And so I did have a second job working in the hospital, and I fell in love with health care. I fell in love with health care, and I’m still really fascinated with American history world history. And so I had an opportunity when I was completing graduate studies. Later, I’m completing graduate studies and I’m working in a clinic because if you work at the hospital, they pay for your education. So I was in graduate school, and I’m working at the U. A. B cancer center and doctors approach me. They say, Sanford, we know that you work primarily and minor procedures, you know, as a surgical technician. And they asked me, said we noticed that you spent a lot of time talking with patients before every procedure, and I said, Well, they need to understand what? Why they’re in here and they approach me. And the doctor said, We’re gonna open up a prostate cancer clinic and we want you to be the clinic coordinator And I said, Well, that sounds like a great thing. If I do this the focus of the entire clinic with the patient education and there will be a focus on disparities primarily with blacks who don’t have insurance primarily who don’t understand a lot about why they’re here. And the doctor said, Make it happen. And so I became a clinic coordinator for the Prostate cancer Clinic, the U. A B Comprehensive Cancer Center. It’s much like M. D. Anderson in Houston. It’s a national recognized, comprehensive cancer center. So I had an opportunity Christian to interact now on the research side of cancer. And subsequently I also facilitated a cancer support group. And that’s how my role is an advocate began. Because I became ah, member of many of cancer organizations. I went to a lot of trainings to learn more about what advocacy was about. I was very fortunate and that I had a mentor in Birmingham. She’s deceased

[0:10:57 Speaker 2] now. Dr.

[0:10:58 Speaker 0] Beverly Layer was a two time cancer survivor, and she actually recruited me to become a cancer research advocate. And that’s how I started my journey in a cancer advocate. Even now, I serve as the chair elect for the Esco Health Equity Committee. Esko is the American Society for Clinical Oncologist. I’m also a patient advocate with a A C R, and I’m also a member of the Hickory Manuscript Review Board. I just finished service on the Clinical Trials Advisory Board. One of the things that I’ve done throughout my career is focused a lot of attention, not just severally on cancer research but also on the role of patient education and my background. Even in my doctorate, my background and research interest is intervention. And how do I prevent someone from actually getting diagnosis with aggressive cancer? Cancer is these abnormal sale growths in the body, But we also understand that there’s a cancer diagnosis that may not be a death nail for someone when they get cancer. And I think today we all understand that when someone hears the word cancer, we immediately unfortunately, especially if you’re a person of color. If you’re someone that as a marginalized population, a vulnerable population or underrepresented cancer diagnosis is going to equate to not very good outcomes. I think my role as a history teacher has a lot to do with my role now on how I approach my work as a cancer advocate.

[0:12:41 Speaker 2] I love that so much that, you know the history teacher piece of you never went away. It seems very overwhelming. You and I have talked before and you’ve said, Well, I’m I’m just really impatient. I’m like, Well, yeah, you should be. This is this’ll is a big broken system and, like, how do you not get overwhelmed? How do you stay hopeful?

[0:13:06 Speaker 0] I stay very hopeful in a lot of the work that I do because the conversations are now changing. Even in the present day year of 2020 we have social unrest. We have attentiveness to racism. We have more attention now to public health because of Cove it because of all the George Floyd’s Briana Taylor’s Trey von Martin. It’s almost as if now we’re at a point where everyone understands the system is necessarily, they say the system is broken. The system needs to be amended because our society has changed. When I first started doing this work 20 years ago. This is how long I’ve been doing it, particularly being an advocate. I’ve been a patient advocate 20 years ago, the conversations that all of us air having were not occurring at all. And I say it for this reason, even the design of cancer research. We were still focusing a lot on the patient. We said the patient doesn’t know a cancer research trial exist What I found over the last 10 years in my work in community research, I’ve done a lot of work to ask questions to do surveys, and we find out that many black people would participate in clinical research if it was introduced. And so what we find out there now we recognize there are biases on the side of the researcher community Research Christian takes a very long time. Community research involves building of relationships with the community. How do they approach healthcare? I try to learn without asking. Where are the local community clinics? How are people finding out about a cancer doctor? How do people find out about the live strong program that you all have for cancer survivors and what we find out in those communities. They don’t know about the live strong program in the community because Live strong has not gone to the community to find out if anyone knows about them in these systems that we recited, it might be an academic institution. It might be health care. Institution will find out. How much do they really trust us? And we will find out why they don’t trust us. And so, as a community based researcher, I’ve been able to combine education as well as my interest in cancer research. I’m fascinated with cancer research, even on the side of treatment base cancer research. I want to know how more people can actually benefit from cancer clinical trials. And so my, uh, my journey has been, I think it’s been interesting and that it has not been a straight pathway in terms of becoming a cancer research advocate. But I’d like to think that I’ve been able to play a part in providing voice two populations that ordinarily we were not listening to do too many other issues that we have.

[0:16:32 Speaker 2] Well, thank you for the incredible work that you dio I see it because I work with you at East Side Memorial, and I see the impact that you have on your students because they tell me. So I am thankful to know you through that program and through your students. And it’s incredible to me to hear your story and how you got here. So I am. I’m thankful for your time and thankful for your work, your ongoing work and, I think, ask those lucky tohave you as well in your new role there. Is there anything that I should have asked or that we didn’t talk about?

[0:17:10 Speaker 0] I think one of the things I would like to say and it goes to my role here and working with high school students I worked with high school students and the student population are majority students of color. They are Hispanic and African, Asian as well as Indian. And I think one of the things that I’m trying to do in my role with high school students is really convey to them that they can go into health care in an area that they probably have not seen. And I do talk a lot to students. I really push them a lot to consider cancer research, particularly on the side of population science, and I do want all students or listeners to understand you do not have to wait until you get to medical school in order to go into cancer research. You do not have to wait even until you get to undergraduate and graduate programs. The live strong cancer in the classroom program is a very good first step in teaching high school students that we need mawr cancer researchers on the community education side, which also is a combination of the public health

[0:18:28 Speaker 2] side. The

[0:18:29 Speaker 0] last thing I want to say from this, I believe that we can develop MAWR students to go into the science of cancer research. But I firmly believe this. I firmly believe that basic education around cancer is a great start for our students to understand once we learn Maura about not necessarily the cancer diagnosis but the cycle social aspect of cancer support services, the mental aspect, cancer prevention through lifestyle and diet. Those are the things that our students can actually begin right now while they’re in high school, and when they actually become an undergraduate or graduate school there now, understanding ah lot Maura about not necessarily cancer from the standpoint of the diagnosis. But now students are understanding. How do I help shape this message around cancer prevention? But more importantly, how do I also shake this message around him? Importance off participation off my community into cancer research? The message comes from them.

[0:19:44 Speaker 2] Mm, Thank you, Dr James, for taking the time to talk to us about your career and your work. If you have questions for Dr James or have Mork answer questions that we can uncover, please email us at live strong cancer institutes at del med dot utexas dot e d u toe. Learn more about being a cancer research advocate. You can read a post from Dr James on cancer dot net. Once you’re there, simply search for what is a cancer research advocate. To learn more about the live strong cancer institutes, visit del med dot utexas dot e d u toe. Learn more about the live strong Cancer institutes clinic at UT Health Austin Visit UT health austin 0.0.0.0.0.0.0 r. G. You can also follow Gail, our chair and fearless leader on Twitter at s scale. Eckhart Eckhart is spelled e c k h a r D t. This is Kristen win for cancer uncovered. Thank you for listening and learning with us.